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+ Birthtime Calculation,rectification and lagna fixing +

Time of Birth


Is the following statement correct? "Birth represents independent existence of the baby's body from mothers body. Many have wondered what is the point of birth, maybe when baby's head comes out, or when the whole baby is out... there are so many different theories. The answer is when umbilical cord which is connecting mother and baby is cut. Only at that point baby starts to exist separately from the mother and that is called point of birth. This is very fundamental principle. On the basis of this principle the horoscope is made."


Yes, there was a very big debate in one of the classes in Delhi on this and this is the final answer. Nadi Sodhana..cutting of the umbilicus is the correct time.


In this regard, I checked with my sister, who is a gynecologist. She said, the moment the baby starts crying, the blood circulation from the mother through umbilical card stops and the baby starts its own breathing. So, even if we are not cutting the card, the connection ceases. So, she said normally they consider for their purpose, the time the baby cries or the baby starts breath is the time of birth.


As regards blood circulation, let me tell you that even after the cutting of the limb of a person, his astral limb exists. Thus the cutting of the umbilical chord is the actual time of birth..signifying independence from mother. Circulation is no criteria as the milk that the mother continues to feed to the child is also a part of her blood. This is the reason as to why MARS is also a STHIRA KARAKA for mother along with the Moon. The father contributes his semen and the Venus is sthira Karaka for father along with the Sun.

Measuring birthtime from sun, why?


GMT is local mean time for Greenwich, i.e. 12.00 GMT is local noon at Greenwich. The Ascendant covers the whole zodiac in 24 hours, thus making a 360 degree circle. 24 hours is 1440 minutes, and this divided by 360 is 4 minutes per degree. So the midheaven (the point of the Suns crossing the meridian of the place) moves with the same angular speed > (1 degree per 4 minutes) and therefore this is the equation for calculating the local mean time for any longitude on the earth. So we might say that GMT is arbitrary, but if we take any other point, the equation will be the same and give the same result. Therefore the point of beginning (0 deg longitude) may be any point and LMT may be calculated from it, be it Greenwich or Ujjain or whatever other place. And the Suns crossing the midheaven is not an arbitrary point in time but coincides a natural phenomenon occurring in all longitudes of the earth. Why Hora? Hora means a half of a sign (15 degrees) and there are 24 of them in the whole zodiac. So if we take that the Lagna or Midheaven of whatever fixed point of the place takes exactly 24 Horas to go around the zodiac, then it is more clear why we link the Horas not to the SUN, but to the MIDHEAVEN. A Hora is the definition based on the Rasi. And Rasis (especially in the sidereal zodiac) are not based on the Sun, but on the Nakshatras. So the only way to arrive to a circle divided into 12 equal Rasis and 24 equal Horas is based on the movement of the Midheaven around the zodiac. The movement of the Sun differs a bit, thats why if the Rasis are determined on the basis of the Suns position, we arrive to the Tropical Zodiac, which shifts compared to the sidereal. I have only one question after this: Why is the birth time calculated in Ghatikas from the Sunrise? This measurement is clearly based on the Sun, and 60 ghatis (especially as they are equal to 24 Horas) would almost never match a Solar day (lasting from sunrise to sunrise), only on the days of equinox. Even then in the spring it may differ a bit from the autumn one. So what is the significance in measuring the birth time from sunrise? How do they do that in the poles?


Your understanding is correct, but for a few technical points. What you say as ascendant is actually the BHAVA LAGNA which moves @ 1 degree in 4 minutes. The Sun is the Naisargika Atmakaraka and the visiblity of the Sun's upper limb has been used for Poojas and Yagna since time immemorial. The most important point is that the SUN is the Creator or the cause of the Lagna. If there was no Sun (figureatively, Atma or Vishnu) then there would be no need for a body. This is the explanation for the traditional use of the measurement of the time in Ghatika's from Sunrise. Thus if a baby is to be born, then it is the Atma that comes first and then it enters food, from food to sperm, from sperm to egg and from egg to baby. Thus the Atma causes the Lagna to come into existence. Hence all measurement of Astrological time for the sake of explanation of individual births is from the Sun. However, the Yuga and others are explained on the basis of time. These affect individuals, but are not dependent on the individuals. Thus when Jaimini asks us to measure the Birth time from Sunrise or Sunset to determine the sex of the child, he is teaching an important lesson in giving the primacy to the Atma. He is also teaching a second very important lesson that the Sunrise (symbolising first house) or the sunset (symbolising seventh house) are the two houses of the Satya Peetha as these symbolise the Sun or the house aspected by the Sun (7th). This is the basis for choosing the stronger between the first and seventh house for the starting of all the various types of Rasi Dasa. These two houses become Satya Peetha and the Maya Pada (Arudha Pada) cannot fall in these houses. Thus this also teaches that the Arudha Pada of any house cannot fall in the same house or the seventh from it.

Birthtime rectification technique


About the rectification table mentioned by Bhushan ji: I met Sri P.V.R.Rayudu (he said Bhushan ji contacted him before), a retired scientist. He was a neighbour and a sishya of Sri D.V. Subba Rao. Sri Subba Rao's books are out of print, but Sri Rayudu gave me the gist of the rectification technique mentioned in a book. It is essentially what Prof. P.S. Sastri described in his book on rectification (tattwa and antartattwa). There is a minor (but important) difference between what Prof. P.S. Sastri and others do and what Sri Subba Rao does. They take only aarohana, but Sri Subba Rao takes aarohana and then avarohana.


Sri Subba Rao is correct. The Full cycle consists of Aaroha and then avaroha gati. To ignore the latter is like ignoring the night and saying that i know the meaning of the full day, just because I know "day"... HORA..Day& Night..similarly, the gati of the tatwa and the antartattwa will also fall into Aaroha (Day) and Avaroha (Night) gati. This is the basis of the Sama & Vimsa rasi as well as the Samapada & Vimsapada rasi. Sri Subbarao has understood correctly. There is yet another confirmation based on the Vighatika of birth, besides some points on Navamsa-Dwadasamsa...

Following is the diagrammatic representation of the sunrise by Mr.Narasimha Rao.