Post
posted 05-28-98 11:00 AM CT (US)
------------------------------------------------------------In these spring nights, I often dream with the Japanese patent,
Process for producing phenylacetones (alkyl nitrite in
corresponding alcohol + safrol + PdCl2 [+ CuCl2 or amine ] =
MDP2P). I've dreamed always with methyl nitrite maden from a
solution of NaNO2 in methanol and water and dropping dilute
H2SO4. A lot of dreams with CuCl2 cocatalyst and some with
trimethylamine, and never yield was the claimed in patent.
Then I realised desired cocatalyst effect of CuCl2 or
trimethylamine never was. Why ? I don't know. Always Pd Turnover
( mols of product/ mols of PdCl2 ) was between 15 to 20, never
166 as patent claims. So I satarted to dream using
Some days ago I had a powerful dream :
1'75 liters of drugstore methanol and 6 grams of PdCl2 was
bubbled with MeONO produced with a solution of 110 cc of
methanol, 225 grams of NaNO2 and 300 cc of water (110 cc of
H2SO4 and 200 of water, chilled was added to the NaNO2 in 2'5
hours ). With stiring, of course, and with a homemade bubbler
made with a piece of glass sponge (for feet) welded to a glass
tube. After the adition of about 200 grams of NaNO2, 100 grams
of safrol (100 cc of single distilled safrol) was added.
Catalyst was not dissolved, but the reaction went to 35-40
degrees, with a great bubbling of NO and after a while all
catalyst dissapear. In 30 minutes or so reaction was done, I
think, and palladium appear again, but all MeONO was bubbled,
and reaction was kept 2 hours from the safrol addition. Then
was added 135 cc of water (water is not good before because
MeONO is less soluble in methanol-water mix, so you need more
solvent) and was stired two hours more. Methanol was evaporated
at low pressure, the result , with no safrol smell at all (all
safrol reacted) was basified, what produced a lot of brown tar
wich was filtered, and extracted with 100, 100 and 70 cc of
toluene. Toluene was distilled and the ugly deep brown product
was distilled at 158-165 C with a water pump and all joints
sealed with silicone products to give ... 81 grams of MDP2P.
Great !!! It is a 73 % yield, and I'm sure yield is more,
because my dream procedures are not exactly academic. Also
distilling flask was 500 cc to distill 100 cc, so at the end,
with good temperature, it was impossible to distill some residue.
No safrol or isosafrol in the product, only MDP2P and more heavy
products, I think these are something like pyperonyl acetic acid,
acetaldehyde and others.
Advantages, no O2 cylinders, easy to done, NaNO2 is OTC or no
suspicious product, methanol is from drugstore... Problems,
don' forget re-direct MeONO and NO fumes out through the window
with a plastic or rubber tube. Really toxic, but well done, no
problem at all. After basic wash a lot of brow tar was formed
sunlight
quirks
sunlight
sunlight
quirks
TaRa
quirks
Mr X
quirks
sunlight
sunlight
Labrat
quirks
fudd
fudd
r2d3
Q10
Osmium
sunlight
interesting.
Fester's procedure is intelligent, so I use it. But Fester
don't know exactly the reaction. For example, palladium is in
the organic phase. If you don't wash it with dilute NaOH you
will have a lot of palladium in the distilling flask, two
person have reported an explosion in distillation, may be for
this reason. Fester procedure is partially ok, not
completely. There are many errors in SOMM, so it's
interesting to clear up things.
May be all people know this rxn, may be this report is
unnecessary, then excuse me.
BTW. Mr X, yes chilled methanol increase (of course)
absortion of MeONO, Ive done it. Working with small
quantities it's possible to weight absortion. But I want to
try a general method. As Fester, but tested. If you don't
have enough NaNO2, chilled methanol reduce the amount needed
to 2/3 parts more or less.
Labrat
quirks
sunlight
TaRa
Piglet
the junk...
All the best,
Piglet :)
sunlight
seperated with
recycling the
product mixture,
again, throwing out
sunlight
=================================================================
This file is a part of the 1999 Hyperreal Drug Archives Snapshot.
This snapshot is hosted by Erowid and will not be updated after
October 1999. The information in these files may be out of date.
See Erowid's Psychoactive Vaults for more current info.
=================================================================
freya
quirks
Osmium
007
Osmium
ChemHack
quirks
Rhodium
quirks
ChemHack
sunlight
ChemHack
=================================================================
This file is a part of the 1999 Hyperreal Drug Archives Snapshot.
This snapshot is hosted by Erowid and will not be updated after
October 1999. The information in these files may be out of date.
See Erowid's Psychoactive Vaults for more current info.
=================================================================
From: eleusis@netcom.com (Eleusis)
Subject: REPOST: ZWITTERION's Complete MDMA Experience
Date: 1996/02/27
Message-ID: <4gv35d$dig_003@netcom.com>#1/8
sender: eleusis@netcom.netcom.com
organization: A Lonely Laptop on the Fringe
newsgroups: alt.drugs.chemistry
The Complete ZWITTERION Observations on Making MDMA
-----------------------------------------------------------------------Data and text provided by: ZWITTERION (anonymous user)
Editing, compilation & explanatory notes by: eleusis@netcom.com
This text describes the complete process of making MDMA starting from
the essential oil extracted from Ocotea Cymabrum (Brazilian Sassafras).
ZWITTERION wished me to put his observations into a more fluid and
correct form for "reference" use, so I am obliging. He gave me free
license to edit where necessary, but I will tend to keep modifications
offset by brackets [E - ] to indicate my intrusions, with the exception
of spelling/grammar mistakes, which will not be offset. For humor
purposes I will also leave most of his rants and raves in. Also, this
is *not* a step-by-step synthesis, but the observation of following
previously published syntheses. Those syntheses are from the sources:
The Safrole Isomerization Document - eleusis@netcom.com
PiHKAL Synthesis #109, pg734-735 - Dr. Alexander and Ann Shulgin
[PiHKAL = Phenethylamines I Have Known And Loved]
Data interjected by me can be found in the sources:
The Merck Index, 11th ed.
Essential Oils, Gunther
Lange's Handbook of Chemistry, Lange
The Organic Chem Lab Survival Guide, Zubrick
***
[E - compare the structures of Safrole and Isosafrole:
Safrole - 3,4-Methylenedioxyphenyl-1-propylene
O /\\ /\ //
/ \ / \\/ \//
/ || |
\ || |
\ / \ //
O \//
bp(760): 232C; d(20): 1.096
Isosafrole - 3,4-Methylenedioxyphenyl-2-propylene
O /\\ /\\ /
/ \ / \\/ \\/
/ || |
\ || |
\ / \ //
O \//
Okay, so the temperature falls in the flask and it's been 3 hours so
what the fuck - let's dump this baby into a goddamn beaker and start
EXTRACTING. Whoa there! Better chill that shit down first... nothing
like having ether contact something that's currently TWICE IT'S BOILING
POINT. Yah - That'd be pretty spectacular.
So ZWIT sets the beaker in ice water while preparing the necessary
reagents for all the washes and extractions. After the ketone/acid mix
has cooled to about 18C, ZWIT notes the color and appearance. There are
two layers present, though not entirely immiscible. A dark, almost black
one is on the bottom - the ketone layer, and a translucent reddishyellow one is on top (the yellow is only apparent near the glass-liquid
interfaces, though). ZWIT does the customary three-volumes of ether
extraction and combines the extracts, keeping them in the freezer all
the while. A total of 225mL of ether is used. ZWIT sets aside the postextraction aqueous solution JUST IN CASE!
Next comes the water wash. ZWIT uses CHILLED distilled water in two
washes of 100mL each. The wash water looks much like the aqueous postextraction layer, proving the wash was a neccessary step. NOW COMES THE
TRICKY PART!
The final wash is with 10% Sodium Hydroxide solution, and this one is a
BITCH. Why? Because a lot of the black shit goes into the hydroxide
layer, MAKING IT INDISTINGUISHABLE FROM THE ORGANIC LAYER! ZWIT does a
single wash with 100mL of 10% NaOH, but notices that it would be smarter
in the future to do 2 or 3 washes of 50mL each. ZWIT solves the "can'ttell-which" problem by REMEMBERING how much NaOH solution was added and
holding the sep funnel IN FRONT OF A WINDOW (bright light kids - works
every time).
[E - you definitely want to use a dilute NaOH wash, of larger volume and
split into multiple sections, as ZWITTERION suggests he'd do next time]
The organic layer was dumped into a distillation setup and the ether was
recovered for reuse using ice water in the condenser flow.
Now the vacuum pump is connected and the distillation system is taken
down to whatever the damn thing can manage. There is some VIOLENT
bumping for a minute and a little water jumps through to the receiver.
ZWIT ignores it because a little water never hurt MDP-2-P before. The
heating mantle was cranked way up for the projected 200C distillation
temp and a pale yellow begins to condense at around 180C. When charring
appeared imminent, the mantle was dropped down from around the flask and
the vacuum released. It charred anyway. Bastards!
The distillate is a PALE YELLOW OIL that smells JUST LIKE CARDAMON goddamn! That's a NICE bit of information to know, kids! And that smell
is the smell of MDP-2-P. Yes!
The yield of the distillate, and GET THIS KIDS, was 20.6g! Can you
believe that? To the goddamn tenth of a gram JUST LIKE SHULGIN. Maybe my
lab technique ain't so bad after all?
Oh, and just like most ketones, be careful with it and PLASTIC! A drop
got on the top of ZWIT's scale and started EATING A HOLE THROUGH IT!
Here's a quick review and chronology:
waters are
small amount of
overhead" that
MPTP or
ZWIT decants the overhead and filters on the vacuum buchner. Next, 25 mL
of Methanol is added to the sludge and half is filtered. The paper is
changed and 25mL more MeOH is added for filtering the remaining half.
The total filtered solution is then distilled under vacuum. The
temperature rises from a start of about 37C to 53C where it stays for
SEVERAL HOURS. There is A LOT of liquid that must be removed from the
mixture, so be prepared to spend a LONG time at the vac. pump. BTW ZWIT estimates his pathetic pump to be pulling a GODDAMN WORTHLESS 80mm
Hg, assuming the highest boiling fraction to be stripped is water. After
a total of approximately 8 hours distilling, there remained 55g of a
reddish-yellow liquid with some water and perhaps 10g of what appeared
to be regular old table salt. I wasn't about to sprinkle any on my
dinner, if you know what I mean.
ZWIT only has 2 250mL Sep funnels, so the next part of the process was
a REAL TREAT, lemme tell ya. The reddish liquid was dumped into a half-
>Dal Casson suggests that MDP2P and NH4OH will work with Al/Hg, but
>seems generally unreliable as he says of the NaBH4CN synthesis that it
>does not require complex glassware, when Shulgin ends this synthesis with
>distillation at 0.2 torr.
Shulgin distilled at .2t because he *could*. Glassware should be considered
de rigeur for this type of experimentation, though. Distillation with an
aspirator is quite acceptable, IF your water supply has a high enouugh
pressure. See an upcoming post for a good trick to get around that problem.
>If Al/Hg does work for MDA, can anyone suggest conditions?
Hehe... oh, that's the *good* question. Lot's can be suggested, but if you
don't have access to some serious analytical equipment, how are you going
to know what you got and how much of it? However, it would be safe to say
that substituting ammonia for methylamine and proceeding as in #109 would
be a good start.
>There is such a vast difference between keeping things below 60 C, and
>refluxing for 8 hours at 100 C. Also, should one add NaCL, and NaOH as
>shulgin does when making MDMA (I'd guess that the NH4OH is so basic that
>the NaOH is redundant).
No, CH3CH2 (methylamine) is much more basic than ammonia, so if anything
you will want to add slighly more NaOH.
>Having created the MDA freebase, at what temp does it begin to decompose?
>Shulgin gives Bp0.2 as 80 C, I fear decomposition at a relativly low temp
>as he gives Bp2 and Bp20 for MDP2P, but no mid-vaccum boiling points for
>MDA. I'd be curious to know its Bp at 5 torr if it would not have
>decomposed before boiling ath this preassure.
5 torr should be more than adequate. As I noted above, distillation at the
water pump (40t) should be more than adequate. Decomposition probably is
not significant within 20C of it's 760t boiling point.
>Shulgin (#100) suggests forming MDA.HCl by dissolving in C3H7OH & adding
>HCl (aq) and (C2H5)2O, while fester dispenses with the alcohol and uses
>gaseous HCl. Which method is best?
Bubbling gaseous HCl makes crystal recovery much easier. You need only
filter and collect, but you also have to generate the HCl gas. There is no
real difference, yield wise, between the two, though. It's whatever you
prefer.
>If Fester's alcohol-free method works, would it work of one used butane
>rather than ether?
Why not? It's a bit of pain to handle, but as long as you keep it cold, no
problem.
*For intellectual pursuits only*
-. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
magnets in place, the requisite amount of methanol was added, and as much
15% Sulfuric Acid as could be working on the premise that as it evaporated
off over the 3 hour hydrolysis time, more would be added. The beakers were
placed in a hot water bath that barely got the core reaction temp up to
75C, but it seemed fine. The smell was different, but ZWIT assumed that
this was the result of the "cleaner neutralization" process, as compared to
vacuum distillation. So far, in just this process alone, we have racked up
2 variables! Poor form on ZWIT's part!
After hydrolysis, the solutions were individually neutralized and extracted
with CH2Cl2 (2 more variables, total of 4). The solvent was stripped off,
flashed with vacuum to get the last bit out, then the vacuum cranked down
hard to 10mm Hg and the "yellow oil" distilled off. the distillation range
covered from 120-160C, which is unusually WIDE. Normally the range is
145-165C. The product was the familiar yellow oil, had the "right" smell,
etc... If I actually had kept some MDP-2-P from a previous batch, though,
it would have been obvious that something was seriously wrong!
Error #2 - 4 freakin' variables were introduced into this process! 1) the
glycol ester was neutralized with base instead of concentrated under
vacuum, 2) the glycol ester was hydrolysed on a water bath which only got
the temp up to 75C instead of refluxed in a flask with a heating mantle @
100C, 3) the post-hydrolysis mixture was neutralized with base instead of
extracted & washed and 4) the crude "ketone" was extracted with methylene
chloride instead of toluene or ether.
The result was a homogenous mixture of the alcohol & the ketone.
No surprise then that the Al-Hg reduction failed, then, huh? But the
trickies bastard part of this collection of fuckups is that all the errors
pointed to a PROBLEM WITH THE Al-Hg REDUCTION, NOT THE INITIAL SCREWUP WITH
THE ISOSAFROLE!!! To further compound the problem, a different brand of
Aluminum foil was used! The biggest mystery that faced ZWIT was why E &
me's process, which had a screaming yeild up to this point, suddenly
dropped by 50% while also making a nasty goo which was nearly impossible to
crystallize!?!?! My reasoning and deduction process is listed below,
substantially assisted by the venerable bastard himself, e.
Observations: the almagam reduction gives a 50% yield instead of 85%, the
product is oily and difficult to crystallize, a substantial part is lost in
the acetone wash, later runs where the freebase was distilled yielded the
PROPER AMOUNT OF OIL, the color of the reaction was the same, two layers
formed in the flask as usual after vacuum filtering off the oxidized
aluminum, the reduction was finished within 3 hours instead of 7, the
temperature was unusually easy to control, there weren't too many fumes
being made.
The strangest clue came at batch #6 when ZWIT vacuum distilled the crap
left over from solvent washing the post-reduction, post-concentration
mixture. What ZWIT found, not surpisingly, was the alcohol!!! E was totally
floored by this, saying that there was no way the Al-Hg reduction could
reduce the ketone back to the alcohol, but the proof was there, so we
thought! E asked about the ketone, and ZWIT told him it looked normal what else could E do??? He suggested ZWIT try using plain old Reynolds wrap
and see if that corrects the problem. No dice, yield was even worse. All
this time, ZWIT was prepping the isosafrole with the same carelessness, and
the MDP-2-P without modification - ZWIT didn't want to introduce any new
variables! Hah!
Finally, ZWIT started to suspect the ketone, and reverted back to the
>
>
>Alright, how about with triple distilled 99.999% mercury and aluminum
>foil. Ground the shit out of it with a glass mortar and pestle and
>still just got grey powder.
We could talk chemistry in this newsgroup for a change. Mechanically
combining mercury and aluminum and mercury will produce a crude
amalgam of the same quality as the dental amalgam I have in my mouth. But
that does not necessarily give the best mercury/aluminum amalgam to be
used for chemical reduction. The way to make such an amalgam is
chemically by reducing a solution of mercuric chloride with the
aluminum. That way there is a uniform thin molecular layer of mercury all
over the aluminum. Some people like to use aluminum foil for
convenience but others prefer to grind their own aluminum dust.
Aluminum tends to resist oxidation because the surface forms a layer
of aluminum oxide which resists further oxidation. It may be necessary
to react the aluminum with dilute NaOH to remove the oxide layer and
to promote the reaction with the mercuric chloride. When the reaction
has deposited a uniform layer of mercury on the aluminum, the excess
mercuric chloride can be washed away.
The purpose of the mercury layer is to make the aluminum into a
reducing agent. In the absence of this treatment it will not react
because of the oxide layer. The mercury allows the aluminum atoms to
diffuse to the surface one atom at a time where it can engage in an
organic reduction reaction. Also the mercury has the highest hydrogen
overpotential so reducing power is not wasted in the
production of hydrogen gas which occurs in most dissolving metal
reactions. Aluminum engages in dissolving metal reaction under basic
condition which makes it suitable for reductive aminations. Zinc
amalgam works under acidic conditions, on the other hand.
A while back someone posted a report on electrochemical reduction
using a clay pot with a pool of mercury at the bottom. Exactly the
same principles apply but without the necessity of aluminum.
=================================================================
This file is a part of the 1999 Hyperreal Drug Archives Snapshot.
This snapshot is hosted by Erowid and will not be updated after
October 1999. The information in these files may be out of date.
See Erowid's Psychoactive Vaults for more current info.
=================================================================
From: "John Payne" <aj6742741309@Big.Black.Vagina.remailer.com>
Merck Index. The entry for will lead you to the original literature which
details the synthesis of sodium cyanoborohydride and also the typical
procedures used in reductive amination or other selective reductions.
Sodium cyanoborohydride can be made by reacting equimolar quantities of
sodium borohydride and hydrogen cyanide in THF. One gram of hydrogen
cyanide can kill one hundred men so do not attempt this unless you are a
first rank chemist like me. The hydrogen cyanide is made following a
procedure found in Organic Synthesis, Collective Edition. Work at the 50
-100 gram scale in a distillation apparatus with ground glass joints. Emil
Fischer established the practice where you must smoke cigarettes while you
do this work. Nicotine accentuates the taste of HCN to give you an early
warning of danger. In the absence of a fumehood wear scuba gear when
disassembling the glassware. Store the liquid HCN frozen in the freezer.
Combine equimolar quantities of NaBH4 and HCN in THF and allow the reaction
to go to completion with the evolution of H2. Remove the THF with a rotary
evaporator. If you do not own a rotary evaporator go out and buy one right
now. The NaCNBH3 you made fresh is better than any you can buy. If you
don't mind the heat, go out and buy the NaCNBH3 instead.
More theory: the reductive amination of the ketone can lead to higher
amines but this can be overcome with the use a five times molar excess of
methylamine. That means that for this reaction you are going to want to
make a large quantity of methylamine hydrochloride. 40% aqueous methylamine
is easy to get and work with. Take equimolar quantities of 40% MeNH2 and
concentrated HCl and make them as cold as you can in a deep freeze. Do the
next part outdoors, clandestine and at night to avoid detection. Combine
the two cold liquids quickly in a 1000 ml beaker. It will get real hot real
quick and a lot of MeNH3CL smoke will be given off but you can put a cover
on the beaker and the smoke will dissipate real quick so the neighbours
will be unaware of what you did. Take the solution inside cool it and then
remove all the water with your rotary evaporator to yield a good crop of
white methylamine hydrochloride as a cake in your flask.
So now you are all set to do your reductive amination of your ketone. You
start with either phenylacetone or with 3,4MDP2P. Organic Synthesis,
Collective Edition describes to methods for making the phenylacetone. One
involves the condensation of acetic anhydride with benzylcyanide using
sodium ethoxide, the other, the tube furnace method from phenylacetic acid.
Or you made the 3,4MDP2P from isosafrole, 30% H2O2 and formic acid
following the "Japanese Method" detailed somewhere in Chemical Abstracts.
You can also find more details of the methods by using DejaNews to wade
through the last several years of this newsgroup.
More theory: sodium cyanoborohydride is a selective reducing agent and it
evolves hydrogen at a slow rate in solution. So you do not want to want to
react at reflux. Reductive amination with sodium cyanoborohydride is best
done in methanol at room temperature. The reaction is mostly over in a day
and a half and 98% yield can be achieved in three days of waiting. Starting
with a given molar quantity of ketone use a 25-50% molar excess of NaCNBH3
based on moles of hydrogen and a five times molar quantity of MeNH3CL in
sufficient methanol to bring everything into solution. The beauty of this
reaction is that you do not need expensive glassware of fixed capacity. You
can work at humungous scale using even a plastic garbage can.
After three days neutralize any unreacted NaCNBH3 using a calculated
quantity of dilute HCl or acetic acid. Remove all of the methanol using
your rotary evaporator. Then dissolve all of the cake in H2O. Add
sufficient 5 N NaOH to cause the desired amine product to separate as a
slightly brown layer floating on top of the aqueous layer. Here is where
the work up can be slightly different depending on whether the product is
methamphetamine or MDMA. The meth cook will sample the meth and continue
his work in an energized manner for many more hours or days. Good meth
cooks tend to be fastidious about the quality of the meth he makes and
does. It is possible to just separate the top layer using a separatory
funnel and to carry on. A better approach is to steam distill the amine out
of the pot. The water in the aqueous layer is sufficient. The steam
distillate is collected. Separation is enhanced by the addition of just
sufficient 5 N NaOH. The floating amine layer is now clear. The top layer
is removed with a separatory funnel an the bottom layer is washed a couple
of times with a small quantity of ethyl ether which is combined with the
top layer. You now have liquid meth with a small quantity of ether, a
little dissolved water and perhaps some MeNH2 or unreacted ketone as a
water white oily liquid. It is traditional to dry this over anhydrous NaSO4
or equivalent. Now set up your vacuum distillation apparatus with a water
aspirator vacuum pump. If you do not own a distillation apparatus with
ground glass joints go out and buy one right now. Depending on your vacuum
the product will distill at 130 C or so and the liquid MDMA somewhat
higher.
With the pure liquid meth it is now time to create the hydrochloride. Many
people think it is possible to create crystal meth using gaseous hydrogen
chloride. I have never seen this to be true. What is obtained instead is an
amorphous product. Why bother. Instead use your HCL gas generator to
produce a quantity of anhydrous methanolic HCL in the case of MDMA or you
can use aqueous HCL for meth. Combine equimolar quantities of HCl solution
and amine product in methanol to neutrality. Use your rotary evaporator to
remove solvent to yield a white cake in your flask. This is crude though
pure methamphetamine HCl or MDMA HCL.
It is now time to recrystallize your immensely valuable product. Dissolve
the cake in the minimum quantity of hot isopropyl alcohol. Cool the IPA
solution in the fridge. Crystallization may begin. Layer the solution on
top with an equal quantity of anhydrous diethyl ether and put beaker into
freezer overnight. I am told it is also possible to use methanol and MEK as
solvent pairs. Overnight the ether layer will be seen to diffuse into the
IPA and a massive crystallization has occurred. Stir if necessary. Some
crystals will be needles upto one mm in length. You are laughing. Separate
solvent from filter mass using a buchner filter and vacuum. Air dry for a
while and then remove residual using a vacuum desiccator. You have a world
class crystalline product. You have money in the bank.
=================================================================
This file is a part of the 1999 Hyperreal Drug Archives Snapshot.
This snapshot is hosted by Erowid and will not be updated after
October 1999. The information in these files may be out of date.
See Erowid's Psychoactive Vaults for more current info.
=================================================================
Name
sunlight
Post
posted 05-28-98 11:00 AM CT (US)
------------------------------------------------------------In these spring nights, I often dream with the Japanese patent,
Process for producing phenylacetones (alkyl nitrite in
corresponding alcohol + safrol + PdCl2 [+ CuCl2 or amine ] =
MDP2P). I've dreamed always with methyl nitrite maden from a
solution of NaNO2 in methanol and water and dropping dilute
H2SO4. A lot of dreams with CuCl2 cocatalyst and some with
Bra, Strike loves it! Consider your post in the book. And a
fat copy of the book to you.
But if anyone else reads this please know that Strike cannot
come across all these posts. If you have something you want
printed, please email or mail Strike the document.
All you bees with something to add REALLY have to submit very
soon or you will miss the publishing deadline!
sunlight
quirks
sunlight
quirks
TaRa
Osmium
quirks
Mr X
sunlight
sunlight
Osmium
Labrat
fudd
fudd
fudd
r2d3
Osmium
sunlight
sunlight
quirks
sunlight
TaRa
Piglet
sunlight
seperated with
recycling the
product mixture,
again, throwing out
Thanks for your replys and keep up the good work, Sunlight!
All the best,
Piglet :)
Piglet
sunlight