Rad

KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

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on: Apr 05, 2012, 08:32 AM

Hi All,
The next topic/ subject that Adina Mather has put together based on the old message board of JWG is one that he
called karma versus evolutionary necessity. Again, as you read through this if you have questions please ask.
Today will begin the posting of this subject, with more to follow in the next days.
God Bless, Rad
***************************************************************************
KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITY
Karma vs. Evolutionary Necessity
(Q): How can one determine the difference between 'evolutionary necessity' and 'karmic necessity' when working
with an individual's chart? My understanding of karma is that it is the debt that is incurred between individuals.
This debt would be a result of one individual having acted in such a way so as to remove the other individual's
ability to choose the direction of his/her life. Psychological abuse comes under this category where the abused
individual is "programmed" by another to follow his/her directions, and the abused is then unable to make the
choices necessary to follow their own evolutionary intent. Another example would be the killing of an individual to
shorten his/her life prematurely, i.e., before that individual has the opportunity to fulfill his/her evolutionary intent
in the current life. I can also see how there may be astrological signatures to be recognized between the charts of
two or more people that would indicate karmic ties, but how does one see "karma" as opposed to "evolutionary
intent" in the chart of one individual?
(A): First, karma can be both difficult or negative and/or positive, reflecting a 'fruition' of what has come before.
So many people in the west think of karma as something that is only negative or difficult.
It can be very, very difficult to assess whether a particular dynamic or experience in a birth chart is a reflection of
karma or evolutionary necessity until one has much experience under one's belt. The same signature, e.g., Mars
square Moon, Moon square Uranus, with Mars and Uranus opposed, could be a karmic signature in one chart and a
signature of evolutionary necessity in another. So how can one tell ? Only thru direct interaction and observation
of the person. One must ask specific kinds of questions that deal with the signatures implicating these two
dynamics, questions that can uncover the difference if one knows exactly the types of questions to ask. One can
only gain this ability by working with many clients over time.
Karma with Countries
(Q): How do past lives spent in various countries/cultures play a role in current lives? I can see how one would be
drawn to certain areas of the world and, therefore, would take more of an interest in the people from the region
which allows you to meet them and engage in intimate relationships and friendships with them and thus fulfill
personal karma with individuals. But is it deeper than that? Can you have actual karma with certain places on the
physical earth?
(A): Yes. One can have a personal karma with a country or area, for example, Hitler. If you knew how he
incarnated after being Hitler and where that incarnation took place, you would know for sure the answer to this
question is yes. Clue: he incarnated quickly after the life of being Hitler right next to the main concentration camp
in Poland, and the physical condition of his body is the proof of this truth.
(Q): The relocation charts and astrocartography would help pinpoint these areas, but is there another way? I
understand why one would be born into one culture or country, etc., but how does this play out with countries/
cultures that you weren't born into in this life?
(A): Yes, there is another way, but it is not yet published. This is based on a project that I have been working on
for over twenty years called "Journeys Through Time." In essence, it combines Cosmobiology, the 90 degree dial,
the Ages and Sub-ages and the use of the geodetic equivalents developed by Johndro. I've been trying to 'perfect'
this system, which is why I have not published anything on it yet, but plan to one day.
(Q): If one is drawn to different countries, is this a reflection of the possible future lives one has there, or to past
lives? Or both?
(A): It can be both.
Taking on Another Person's Karma
(Q): I'm still trying to grasp the ramifications of eighth house issues. For example, what does it really mean that
one takes on another's karma through the exchange of sexual fluids? When one takes on another's karma and the
other has experienced severe trauma, does one automatically experience something like post-traumatic stress,
too?
(A): In some degree, yes.
(Q): In the case of rape, does the victim now take on the rapist's issues?
(A): Yes. There is an osmosis of the underlying psychology of the rapist, so the overall psychology of the one
being raped is affected.
(Q): In the case of "one-night stands" where one no longer sees the person, on what level is that person taking on
that karma?
(A): In addition to taking on the karma, the person takes on the entire history of that other person, their
underlying soul issues.
(Q): This may sound obtuse, but why is this so?
(A): Because every person carries their entire karmic and evolutionary history in their sexual fluids.
(Q): Does it follow that the more partners one has, the more karma one takes on? Does one get more confused,
too?
(A): Yes. The more partners one has, the more karma one absorbs. This can create real confusion and conflicting
emotional states: Is this me, or is this something I have taken in? The problem within this is that most folks do not
have the capacity to discern the difference.
(Q): Finally, can one also take on another's karma just by being in the presence of that person if there is an
intensity of feeling but no sexual union?
(A): No.
The Exchange of Karma
(Q): At the risk of sounding silly, would condoms do anything to prevent the exchange of karma and personal
history? Is it the actual exchange of fluids that transmits karma? Couldn't condoms block this exchange, assuming
no other physical/oral exchanges take place? Or, is the karma transmitted regardless?
(A): Condoms cannot block the intake of sexual fluids. Subtle amounts get exchanged anyway, and beyond that,
all fluids in the body contain this issue of memory, one's entire karmic and evolutionary background. So when we
are sexual with someone, we are exchanging fluids, even through things like our sweat, kissing, and so on.
Osmosis of Karma
(Q): I've been contemplating the law of sexual karma (direct exchange/osmosis of karmic/evolutionary
background in sexual union). The scope of this--the impact--just seems so vast, so I have a couple questions:
First, is the product of sexual osmosis pretty much immediate? In other words, is there a gestation period? My gut
feeling is that its a simultaneous process, but that consciousness takes some length of time to integrate it into
awareness (depending on state of evolution?). Is this right?
(A): Yes.
(Q): In the case of sexual partners in different evolutionary stages (one consensus, one spiritual, lets say), how
does the younger consciousness integrate the advanced vibrations of karmic/evolutionary background osmosed
from the more evolved partner?.
(A): This totally depends on the nature of the person; There is no one answer here.
(Q): Is the affect even comprehendible at a conscious level?
(A): In all cases the answer would be no.
(Q): How do they integrate the essence of these experiences if their own consciousness has not yet reached the
adequate expansion to accommodate that stage of experience for themselves?
(A): Again it depends on the actual nature of the person. In general, though, it has the effect of making them

are sexual with someone, we are exchanging fluids, even through things like our sweat, kissing, and so on.
Osmosis of Karma
(Q): I've been contemplating the law of sexual karma (direct exchange/osmosis of karmic/evolutionary
background in sexual union). The scope of this--the impact--just seems so vast, so I have a couple questions:
First, is the product of sexual osmosis pretty much immediate? In other words, is there a gestation period? My gut
feeling is that its a simultaneous process, but that consciousness takes some length of time to integrate it into
awareness (depending on state of evolution?). Is this right?
(A): Yes.
(Q): In the case of sexual partners in different evolutionary stages (one consensus, one spiritual, lets say), how
does the younger consciousness integrate the advanced vibrations of karmic/evolutionary background osmosed
from the more evolved partner?.
(A): This totally depends on the nature of the person; There is no one answer here.
(Q): Is the affect even comprehendible at a conscious level?
(A): In all cases the answer would be no.
(Q): How do they integrate the essence of these experiences if their own consciousness has not yet reached the
adequate expansion to accommodate that stage of experience for themselves?
(A): Again it depends on the actual nature of the person. In general, though, it has the effect of making them
'reflect' on the nature of 'reality' that they have 'assumed' to be real - because everyone else (consensus) says so.
So, it tends to create over time an acceleration of their soul's evolution AWAY FROM THE CONSENSUS.
(Q): Does this operate something like a higher octave planet would in the less evolved consciousness??
(A): Yes.
(Q): I think about the vestal virgins and wonder if this kind of evolutionary gap was inherent to the work. Is there
any truth to this? Anything you would add?
(A): No, there is no truth to that. The vestal virgins were not selected because of a specific evolutionary condition
or capacity.
(Q): In committed couples such as married partners, am I correct to assume that whatever has transpired in the
life of each individual since the last sexual merging will become directly exchanged and osmosed in the following
union?
(A): Yes.
(Q): So for example, if my partner has been making real efforts to purify and improve himself while I've been
engaging in shady business, and then we sexually unite, this is how this thing works, right? So in terms of sexual
discrimination, this applies not only to partners, but also to 'timing', relative to the quality and nature of
experiences each partner is choosing to engage in independently, which would be another argument for why it is
so important to listen to that inner instinct as one prepares to enter lovemaking, eh!?
(A): Yep.
(Q): In light of the profound metamorphic power contained in sexual osmosis, there must be a way that we as
evolutionary astrologers can identify this dynamic in the birth chart--how it tends to express and operate for a soul
in the lifetime (even as the dynamic is altered at any point in time with the accrual of a new sexual partner, etc.).
So, if I have Pluto in the fourth house, will the karma and evolutionary background that I osmose from any given
sexual partner within the course of my lifetime be fundamentally expressed and filtered through the lessons and
themes of that fourth house?
(A): It would be a synthesis of the fourth house and the tenth house (Plutos polarity).
(Q): Also, considering the sign on the eighth house cusp, the planets aspected by Pluto, the house containing
Scorpio and planets therein, etc., is this the signature to refer to if one wanted to assess the factor of sexual
karma relative to present life issues shaping and playing out in a person's life at any point in time?)
(A): That's part of it, along with Mars, Venus, the Mars/Venus phase, where Aries is located by house, Scorpio by
house, the sign on and planets in the second house, and where Taurus is located.
Karma From the Holocaust
(Q): I'm currently reading a book on IBM's role in the Holocaust and am wondering about the collective karma of
those involved. What is the general karmic fate of the men and women who carried out Hitler's orders or went
along with the Third Reich?
(A): There is no 'general' karma. The only karma would be to those who actually 'knew' of Hitler's intent. The
karma for those who did know in some way correlates to 'the end justifies the means,' gross, sadistic, evil, misuse
of power, the karma of deception and manipulation and the karma created through a consciousness that feels it is
superior to others, etc.
(Q): Is there a general karmic fate for those who worked for corporations (like IBM) who helped to carry out
Hitler's regime?
(A): Again, only for those who actually knew of Hitler's intent. To my knowledge, only a few within the corporate
superstructures did know.
(Q): What was the evolutionary purpose of the millions of Jews who were killed? Were they martyrs to warn the
world of what evil can accomplish if left unchecked?
(A): Yes.
(Q1): I am one-quarter German by heritage. My paternal grandfather and his parents, partially of Jewish descent,
fled to America before Hitler could target them specifically. How would such lineage figure into my karmic/cosmic
mission, if at all? (Note: I am a reformed masochist, with your help!)
(A): That, in fact, is the intent: to purge the masochism.
(Q): I have been recently thinking about the Jews and their treatment during the Holocaust. A lot of esotericists
believe that the Jewish race came here to Earth from a different 'planet.' They are said to be a very special race
because of their innate knowledge and connection to esoteric knowledge, which was far more superior, far more
advanced than most people on Earth. Do you know anything about the Jewish race being 'special' in this manner?
(A): To be blunt: To me, this is total hogwash.
From Karma to Dharma
(Q): You have said that embracing the polarity point of all the planets is a way to break karma. How does the Sun
figure into this equation since it is the current life purpose and how we are integrating and giving purpose and
meaning to this life?
(A): The 'karma' that can be generated by the sun sign in one's chart occurs by the limitation of the sign, the
archetype itself. For example, if I am born with a Sagittarius Sun, which correlates to how I integrate and give
purpose for my whole life, the karma that can be produced would be based on the fact that the Sagittarius Sun
would integrate and give purpose to its life through some kind of religious or philosophical system. The karma that
could be produced would be based on thinking that that system is the 'only' right system for all, which then
manifests as trying to 'convince and convert' others to that one point of view. The karma is in the need to convince
and convert.
In this simple example, the polarity point for that Sagittarius Sun would be Gemini and the archetype of the Earth
itself, as in any polarity sign relative to the Sun. Thus, one would embrace the polarity point by embracing the
natural truth and law that all 'truth' is relative and that there is no one right way to know the total truth. In this
way dharma replaces karma

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Elen

Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Most Active Member

Posts: 879

Reply #1 on: Apr 05, 2012, 03:27 PM

Hi Rad,
I just wanted to chime in with my thanks for your posting all this priceless material.
And many thanks, Adina, for your thoughtful time and effort in putting it all together.
Peace,
Elen

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Rad
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Most Active Member
Posts: 26997

Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Reply #2 on: Apr 06, 2012, 07:38 AM

Hi Jason,
Nice to have you back Jason.
A total understanding of both A's and B's evolutionary and karmic background as symbolized in each of their own
birth charts is necessary. And to remember that if A has osmosed B's karma then B has also osmosed A's if they

purpose for my whole life, the karma that can be produced would be based on the fact that the Sagittarius Sun
would integrate and give purpose to its life through some kind of religious or philosophical system. The karma that
could be produced would be based on thinking that that system is the 'only' right system for all, which then
manifests as trying to 'convince and convert' others to that one point of view. The karma is in the need to convince
and convert.
In this simple example, the polarity point for that Sagittarius Sun would be Gemini and the archetype of the Earth
itself, as in any polarity sign relative to the Sun. Thus, one would embrace the polarity point by embracing the
natural truth and law that all 'truth' is relative and that there is no one right way to know the total truth. In this
way dharma replaces karma

Logged

Elen

Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Most Active Member

Posts: 879

Reply #1 on: Apr 05, 2012, 03:27 PM

Hi Rad,
I just wanted to chime in with my thanks for your posting all this priceless material.
And many thanks, Adina, for your thoughtful time and effort in putting it all together.
Peace,
Elen

Logged

Rad
Moderator
Most Active Member
Posts: 26997

Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Reply #2 on: Apr 06, 2012, 07:38 AM

Hi Jason,
Nice to have you back Jason.
A total understanding of both A's and B's evolutionary and karmic background as symbolized in each of their own
birth charts is necessary. And to remember that if A has osmosed B's karma then B has also osmosed A's if they
have in fact been sexual together. It's a two way street. It is the totality of one another's karma, and evolutionary
history, that each will osmose once there has been a sexual exchange. The DEGREE to which each has osmosed
the other is relative to how deeply committed one or the other has been to one another, and how long the
relationship was in place. The longer it has taken place, and the degree of true commitment are the determinants
here.
If one has a one time sexual exchange with another there is an exchange of one another's karma but the degree
of how much that is then affecting one another is of course greatly reduced compared to long term relationships
between two people.
This is a Natural Law that operates for all of us. There is no one place we can look at in a birth chart to discover
what has been osmosed from one another: it's the totality of one anothers entire karmic and evolutionary history.
The whole chart.
God Bless, Rad

Last Edit: Apr 06, 2012, 08:10 AM by Rad

Rad
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Most Active Member
Posts: 26997

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Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Reply #3 on: Apr 06, 2012, 08:07 AM

continuing ....
Karma and Recent Prior Lives
(Q): In the natal chart, or the current life, is the karma being worked on a direct result of the most recent previous
life, or could it be something from 10 lifetimes ago? Is the good and bad karma 'immediate,' or does it spread
itself out?
(A): The karma being lived out in a specific life can be as immediate as the most recent prior life or as distant as
thousands of centuries ago, with all combinations in between. This is called prarabdha karma from a Sanskrit point
of view, which means in any given life we are not drawing upon all previous lives, only the ones that directly
correlate to the current life evolutionary and karmic purpose.
Cats and Karma
(Q): I hope this isn't a weird question. You wrote before that on a species level we develop karma with other
animals, e.g., dogs and cats and other domesticated animals, through symbiotic relationships that develop over
the ages, etc.
What significance does it have for such a relationship that at various times and places humans have believed that
cats are "evil" (sometimes not as strong as this, hence the quotes) and have subjected them to torture? For
example, the (illegal) practice in Korea of boiling cats alive to make rheumatism medicine and the common belief
there that cats are conniving and not friends of humans, or in medieval Holland, e.g., where to banish evil at the
new year, all black cats would be caught and then hung by their tails over a river while being beaten, until they
were dropped into the river. And various other gruesome practices at other times and other places.
In contrast to this, there is the reverence for cats in ancient Egypt. How does this all affect the relationship
between humans and cats on a karmic level?
Since one of the reasons I was compelled to think of this was that you wrote in your lecture on evil that an agent
of evil's pupils, when looked into deeply, would appear slitted, like cat's eyes, is this part of the reason why
humans have (sometimes and some places) thought that cats are evil? (I am assuming cats are not evil?)
Or would this be similar to the power of belief that you mentioned with regard to the stigmata, that since people
have believed that cats are evil, those who have made contracts with evil will appear, either through some
function of belief on their own part or the part of those seeing them, to have eyes that look like cat's eyes? Or is
this a totally unrelated phenomenon?
(A): The karma that is created between humans and cats or any other animal that is abused because of some
distorted cultural or belief system is ultimately rooted in violations to natural law in general. The karma then is one
in which the offending party--a person or persons--will necessarily experience some kind of traumatic
circumstance linked with animals that has the intent of forcing the person(s) to utterly confront why the traumatic
circumstance occurred in the first place, and then the additional intent of totally readjusting that person's
orientation to the world of animals and nature back to a state of natural balance, all of creation being equal. The
vertical pupil thing within those who have made the contract with evil has nothing to do with beliefs. It is
something that simply naturally occurs as a function of the contract itself. The fact that such pupils mirror a cat's
pupils is a projection of the human upon the cat. Since the beginning there have always been souls who have
made this contract, and their pupils look slitted like a cat's eyes. Humans then projected evil onto cats because
their pupils are like that.
'Cash' Karma
(Q1): Is there an evolutionary stage or condition in which a person often experiences immediate karmic return/
reflection on acts that deviate from the souls return path? If so, is there an astrological signature for this sort of
thing?
(Q2): I have found that the more conscious/aware we are, the quicker the karma is, both positive and negative. I
really think that the more advanced one's evolution becomes the more "direct" and/or quick the karma is, and in
its negative aspect I've found that it becomes pretty clear. In relation to what you said about deviating from one's
true path, it seems to me that the consequence/karma is like a warning sign that is easily integrated into
consciousness, if one asks within.
Thus the responsibility multiplies as we grow and proceed on our evolutionary path. I believe this more conscious
and direct way begins with the first stage spiritual state. I guess it could be felt during the transition from the third
individuated to the first stage spiritual. I don't think there is any astrological sign that specifically relates to this.
(A): It is a function of the evolutionary stages as Q2 has pointed out. There is one astrological signature that also
correlates to the relatively immediate effects of one's own actions like a boomerang, and that is Pluto in opposition
to Mars, in all evolutionary stages.
Karmic Forces
(Q1): In addition to a Pluto/Mars opposition, on the Pluto school tapes you also mention that Mars opposite Saturn
indicates a karmic situationone in which the person is to take responsibility for his or her own actions. What
would be the major difference between the two configurations relative to karmic force?
(A): The prior question referred to the 'instant' karma effect, which correlates to Mars/Pluto in opposition. The
Mars/Saturn opposition does not correlate to that instant effect; quite the opposite. In general, it takes a long time
(Saturn) for the effects of the karma created by a person with such a signature to occur. It's a delayed effect that
can even manifest in another life, the reason being the 'blame' that such people normally project; i.e., pointing the
finger at everyone but themselves and projecting distorted and displaced outward. At worst this can produce some
of the worst forms of sadism. It is this 'pushing' away from accepting their own responsibility for what they have
created that becomes the determinant (Saturn) of the 'appearance' of the delayed effect.
(Q1): I do not have a time for the birth chart for the person in question here, so do not know the houses. If a
person has a Pluto/Mars new phase conjunction in Cancer opposite Saturn and Pluto square the Nodal axis, with
the North Node in Aries, and Uranus combust the North Node, there is obviously lots of trauma forced onto her in
this life in order to evolve. I was wondering if this configuration makes the soul very much 'crushed down' as a
consequence of the person's actions (past and present).

individuated to the first stage spiritual. I don't think there is any astrological sign that specifically relates to this.
(A): It is a function of the evolutionary stages as Q2 has pointed out. There is one astrological signature that also
correlates to the relatively immediate effects of one's own actions like a boomerang, and that is Pluto in opposition
to Mars, in all evolutionary stages.
Karmic Forces
(Q1): In addition to a Pluto/Mars opposition, on the Pluto school tapes you also mention that Mars opposite Saturn
indicates a karmic situationone in which the person is to take responsibility for his or her own actions. What
would be the major difference between the two configurations relative to karmic force?
(A): The prior question referred to the 'instant' karma effect, which correlates to Mars/Pluto in opposition. The
Mars/Saturn opposition does not correlate to that instant effect; quite the opposite. In general, it takes a long time
(Saturn) for the effects of the karma created by a person with such a signature to occur. It's a delayed effect that
can even manifest in another life, the reason being the 'blame' that such people normally project; i.e., pointing the
finger at everyone but themselves and projecting distorted and displaced outward. At worst this can produce some
of the worst forms of sadism. It is this 'pushing' away from accepting their own responsibility for what they have
created that becomes the determinant (Saturn) of the 'appearance' of the delayed effect.
(Q1): I do not have a time for the birth chart for the person in question here, so do not know the houses. If a
person has a Pluto/Mars new phase conjunction in Cancer opposite Saturn and Pluto square the Nodal axis, with
the North Node in Aries, and Uranus combust the North Node, there is obviously lots of trauma forced onto her in
this life in order to evolve. I was wondering if this configuration makes the soul very much 'crushed down' as a
consequence of the person's actions (past and present).
There is definitely an observable "no road through" for her in this life. She has no social power and is continuously
forced down in every aspect of her life. She is in the third stage consensus and in the past held power over others,
participated in the inquisition, etc. She has a sadistic nature that she is totally unaware of and so has no
awareness of what she does to others even in this life. At the same time, she considers herself an absolute victim
of life and others and circumstances, etc. Is it possible for her to develop any kind of awareness about her own
dynamics, and with that type of configuration in her chart, what is the best way to approach all these issues in a
way that could help her to deal with them in a way that is congruent with the boundaries of her consciousness and
reality?
(A). See above. The whole issue only can be resolved when she can finally accept the responsibility for what she
has created and why.
(Q2): With the delay in karmic results, it must be most difficult for people to connect with their responsibility. Do
they find this by learning in small ways how they create their outcomes. Do they find this in therapy or by having
some kind of major emotional breakthrough to realizing past life memories or themes of reincarnation?
Might a Mars/Saturn person begin such a breakthrough by having something like a past life reading with a psychic
counselor? Anything to open the possibility that responsibility can extend from life to life?
(A): In the end, it is what I already said. The individual must determine within him/herself the internal causes that
are responsible for whatever the 'conditions' of their life are via the question, "Why have I needed to create this,
or that, etc.?" This can either occur within themselves and/or the question can be posed to such a person; i.e.,
"Why do you think you needed to create this, that, or whatever?"
Perspectives on the Terrorism
Posted by Jeffrey on September 12, 2001
I woke up this morning to see in the crystal clear dark skies where I live a conjunction between the Moon and
Jupiter overhead and Venus rising brightly on the Eastern Horizon. I sat in deep stillness and reflection upon what
occurred yesterday. Why, Why, Lord? as we have all asked.
Jupiter with the Moon requires knowledge of the truth. What is the truth that could possibly explain this insanity?
The only real answer that came into me was a historical answer: the seeds of this insanity are rooted in our
collective human history, the history--HIS/story--that occurred post matriarchal times. For this is when the
progressive distortions to Natural Law, and the Natural God, began: the progressive definitions of a distorted God
and races of people whose distorted God was better than another race's distorted God. This bred the self-righteous
moralities and justifications for behaviors that these invented distorted Gods dictated. The individuals who carried
out actions towards others on behalf of their distorted gods used the 'religion' to justify carrying out these
unspeakable acts on behalf of God.
We are all too aware of the history of all of this thru the patriarchal centuries. One insane story after another. Let
us remember that all this began historically around 6,000 BCE, the Capricorn sub-age of the Cancer Age. This is
the astrology of when the patriarchy progressively took over from the Matriarchy, or Natural Law.
To me, this latest insanity is but an extension of what has already been occurring for a very long time. To me, it is
the Natural God's way of progressively creating ever increasing shocking and cataclysmic events, the intention of
which is to 'wake us up', to find our way back to Natural Law, the Natural God, to a consciousness that is rooted in
the natural law of 'giving, sharing, and inclusion' versus the patriarchal consciousness rooted in the distortion of
'self interest and exclusion'.
The 'truth' for the U.S. being rooted in all of this is that the original Caucasians who came to this land from Europe
came here for 'religious freedom' and yet used that religious freedom to commit genocide upon the native peoples
who already lived here: One God, the white's, being better and superior to the Indian's--heathen's--God. This was
the delusive self-righteous doctrine of justification called 'manifest destiny'. This root creates it's own karma.
Transiting Mars moved into Capricorn yesterday. The transiting North Node of Mars moved into Cancer, opposing
the transiting Mars. The transiting Mars was conjunct the transiting South Node of the Moon in Capricorn. Here we
see the pointer to the origins of this insanity back into the historical times of when the patriarchy began.
Thru geodetic equivalents Capricorn correlates directly to the U.S. The natal Pluto for the U.S. is in Capricorn. This
country was originally founded on various forms of Christianity, thus, Christ. The astrological symbol for Christ in
the end is the Star of Bethlehem: 17/18 degrees of Pisces, the Venus/Jupiter conjunction. The U.S. birth chart has
Neptune at 22 degrees of Pisces. Yesterday the transiting 'Earth' was exactly at 18 degrees of Pisces directly
opposed to the Sun. Yesterday the transiting Lucifer (Evil) was at 21 degrees of Pisces.
From a Christian point of view, given this country's root was founded upon Christianity, this is a symbol of the
anti-Christ. The ultimate distortion of the Natural God. And, to me, this Anti-Christ is embodied in the ego called
Bin-Laden, the Anti-Christ on Earth--Lucifer conjunct the Earth on the symbol of Christ. Transiting Saturn in
Gemini, through geodetic equivalents, is over Kabul. Saturn in Gemini symbolizes the 'twin towers.'
The truth, to me, is that the forces of the real Natural God are in direct opposition and at war with the forces of
evil, which is born thru the distortions to Natural Law, to the Natural and real God. My fear is that this acceleration
is only the beginning, that many more 'innocents' will be destroyed even if that innocence is an innocence of
ignorance. My fear is that actions, of course, breed reactions, and on and on we go. Where can this lead? My fear
is that it could turn into biological 'religious' terrorism. What then?
Let us all go deep within - to pray and talk deep within to the Natural God/dess of all things, to appeal for grace to
manifest in our times, a grace manifesting as thoughts within the collective that there must be another way. And
let us pray for all those who have lost their lives and for their loved ones, not just this latest insanity in the U.S.,
but for all of those in other lands who have been destroyed in similar ways, and for the same reasons. God Bless,
Jeffrey
Perspectives on the Terrorism - Part 2
Posted by Jeffrey on September 14, 2001
First, I need to correct something that I wrote before: the transiting Lucifer was not at 21 Pisces, but at 21 Virgo,
in opposition to the U.S.'s chart, relative to Neptune at 21 Pisces in opposition to the symbols for Christ, or the
Star of Bethlehem. Let us remember that one of the 'capacities' of the influence of evil is to make the 'opposite' of
the truth to appear as the truth. Thus, even as I was writing my perspective the other day, this influence caused
me to write Lucifer at 21 Pisces. But it does not change the fact of the Anti-Christ being on earth; in fact, it
symbolizes it even more. The transiting Lucifer is conjunct the transiting Sun in the earth sign of Virgo in
opposition to the symbols of Christ, and in opposition to the Neptune in the U.S. chart, which is conjunct the
symbols of Christ at 17 Pisces.
Even yesterday, as I was sitting at my computer doing different astrological calculations for the Anti-Christ, the
current one called Bin Laden, my computer 'suddenly' went haywire--just weird stuff. I do not know for a fact the
birthday of this Anti-Christ, yet if it is as some of you have posted, March, 1957, this would create a natal Lucifer
at 15 degrees of Virgo, which opposes the symbols for Christ.
What I wish to share now is that we have now entered a true 'Jihad,' or Holy War. The forces of Good or God are
in direct opposition to the forces of Evil. The genie is out of the bottle. To know this is to simply validate what is
now happening around this globe in relation to, and as a reaction against, the Anti-Christ, Evil. Never before has
there been such a union among nations to do what must be done as a defense against this Evil. Remember that
Lucifer, symbolically, also correlates to the 'Bearer of Light': God. This again is symbolized by transiting Lucifer
being in opposition to the symbols of Christ, and those symbols being in Pisces: union.
This will be a long war, a long Jihad. It is not over. Every action, of course, creates its own reaction. Evil will not
be defeated easily. But, in the end, it will be. Along the way there could be even more horrific events than we have
just currently experienced. For those who have read my writings or heard me talk in various forums, you know
that I have said that the years between 2001 and 2004 would be the most critical in human history--that very
awful things could occur. We are now, obviously, in this time. Let us deeply pray and ask of the real God/Goddess
as deeply and sincerely as possible, that some of the more cataclysmic things that could occur be mitigated,
blunted, stopped, on behalf of all Souls everywhere who truly wish to harm no one. Souls, who in their own ways,
simply wish to know God and to do good.

Logged

Rad
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Most Active Member
Posts: 26997

Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Reply #4 on: Apr 07, 2012, 07:16 AM

the final part of this subject ......

Hermes revisited: Terrorism in the U.S. and the U.S.'s "Fall from Grace"
(Q): Like everyone else, I am deeply saddened by the recent terrorism against our country, which can only, as

in direct opposition to the forces of Evil. The genie is out of the bottle. To know this is to simply validate what is
now happening around this globe in relation to, and as a reaction against, the Anti-Christ, Evil. Never before has
there been such a union among nations to do what must be done as a defense against this Evil. Remember that
Lucifer, symbolically, also correlates to the 'Bearer of Light': God. This again is symbolized by transiting Lucifer
being in opposition to the symbols of Christ, and those symbols being in Pisces: union.
This will be a long war, a long Jihad. It is not over. Every action, of course, creates its own reaction. Evil will not
be defeated easily. But, in the end, it will be. Along the way there could be even more horrific events than we have
just currently experienced. For those who have read my writings or heard me talk in various forums, you know
that I have said that the years between 2001 and 2004 would be the most critical in human history--that very
awful things could occur. We are now, obviously, in this time. Let us deeply pray and ask of the real God/Goddess
as deeply and sincerely as possible, that some of the more cataclysmic things that could occur be mitigated,
blunted, stopped, on behalf of all Souls everywhere who truly wish to harm no one. Souls, who in their own ways,
simply wish to know God and to do good.

Logged

Rad
Moderator
Most Active Member
Posts: 26997

Re: KARMA AND EVOLUTIONARY NECESSITTY

Reply #4 on: Apr 07, 2012, 07:16 AM

the final part of this subject ......

Hermes revisited: Terrorism in the U.S. and the U.S.'s "Fall from Grace"
(Q): Like everyone else, I am deeply saddened by the recent terrorism against our country, which can only, as
Jeffrey said, be linked to evil. And I pray that we all can 'go within' and realign ourselves with the Natural God/
dess within.
On Jan. 19 of this year I posted my thoughts on the transiting Hermes (which has been in Pisces for the last 60
years and in aspect to our collective nodal axis of Pluto/Saturn in Capricorn/Cancer) as helping us form a bridge
from a patriarchal mindset of self-interest and exclusion back to a matriarchal mindset of giving, sharing and
inclusion. The terrorism on Tuesday sent me back to the U.S. chart, which has Hermes at 11 Sagittarius in the
seventh house: a country which was founded on the principle and vision (Sagittarius) that "all men are created
equal." (seventh house). In relation to Jeffrey's message on our own country being formed also on the principle of
"religious freedom," and yet the Caucasian's genocide of the Native Americans in the doctrine of Manifest Destiny,
the U.S.'s Hermes is in a last quarter semisquare to the nation's Pluto in Capricorn in the ninth: a crisis in the
collective consciousness as to our thinking that ours is the only 'right' way. Transiting Hermes is currently at 28
Pisces (in the eleventh house of the U.S. chart) and is biseptile (first quarter) the natal Hermes, and our current
collective South Node of Uranus in Sagittarius, with Uranus ruling the U.S.'s tenth house. Transiting Pluto is also
on that natal Hermes, a fated aspect to help 'us' stay on course to that original vision (Sagittarius), with the
"imagery" (transiting Hermes in Pisces) of these past several days serving to remind us--if we choose to listen--of
our original vision. The imagery itself is indicative of another view of "one right way for all," i.e., Islam and BinLaden.
More than any other country on earth, we have the freedom to think and 'believe' as we want, both individually
and collectively. We are now, as I see it, first of all, being given the choice as to whether we react (U.S. natal Mars
at 20 Gemini in the first house) or make a considered response (Hermes in Sagittarius in the seventh) to the
recent terrorism in order to bring about justice in the 'proper' way. We are also being given a choice as a country
as to whether we lead the way Pluto in Capricorn in the ninth) back to the matriarchal way of giving, sharing and
inclusion (transiting Hermes in U.S. eleventh house, sextile natal Pluto) or whether, when the dust has settled, we
return to our own way of thinking we alone know what's 'right' for all.
The terrorism also struck the financial underpinnings of the country. The U.S. chart has Lucifer at 22 Aquarius
conjunct the Moon at 18 Aquarius in the tenth and trine Mars Gemini in the first, as well as trine the second house
cusp and Saturn in Libra in the fifth. Lucifer is inconjunct Neptune in Virgo in the fifth, and transiting Lucifer is at
21 Virgo on that natal Neptune and opposite the transiting Hermes, with a yod being formed with the transiting
Hermes, transiting Lucifer and natal Pluto. If we refer back to the message sent by another student with the
reference to so few holding the majority of wealth, will we now be able to see this tragic, horrible disaster as a
'message' (transiting Hermes in Pisces in the eleventh and the above aspects) to redistribute the wealth of this
country along the lines of matriarchal thinking, or again, will we choose to go back to the way we were? (As
Jeffrey taught in his workshop on evil, Lucifer in Aquarius can be using the collective to serve one's own purposes
and in the tenth house, the end justifies the means).
In the first volume of Pluto, Jeffrey wrote that, "The day will come when the United States will 'fall from grace.'
One day it will not be the world power that it is today; it will be one nation among many. This will force a
restructuring of the national Soul so that a new collective self-image can evolve. The national sense of security
linked with being a world power will have to change as a result of this evolutionary necessity." It would seem that
these recent events (reflected in the above aspects) have initiated that process, for as a country, we have felt we
were invincible, that these kinds of things could not happen here. Yet, we have the choice (Pluto) to now
restructure that national Soul (Pluto in Capricorn, which is conjunct our collective South Nodes of Saturn and Pluto
in Capricorn/Cancer and transiting Hermes in Pisces in U.S.'s eleventh house, biseptile the natal Hermes in
Sagittarius, the collective South Node of Uranus in Sagittarius and transiting Pluto conjunct the Hermes and South
Node of Uranus) according to those natural principles of giving and sharing and inclusion, making the U.S. a world
leader in a new and different way. Would you please comment on all this, Jeffrey? Is this the beginning of that 'fall
from grace?'
Jeffrey: Response to the Message About the U.S.'s "Fall From Grace"
Posted by Jeffrey on September 15, 2001
First, this is now the third time, trinity, to get the astrology right over this insanity. The natal Neptune for the U.S.
is at 21 degrees of Virgo, not Pisces. What this creates for this madness of 9/11 is a transiting Sun and transiting
Lucifer over the U.S. Chart's Natal Neptune making a square to its natal Mars in Gemini. Assuming the birth data
of Bin-Laden is March, 1957, then his natal Lucifer conjuncts these points, and the transiting Lucifer marks a
Lucifer return for him, which serves as the timing for this attack on the U.S.
The student above asked about the potential 'fall from grace' relative to the U.S. and its role in the world, that
evolutionarily there would be a time in which it would be disillusioned from its assumed superiority from a
religious, economic, and political point of view and the values and moralities that this implies. And within this is
the issue of a sort of collective attitude within the U.S among its citizens that basically only focuses upon itself,
that the events and realities of other nations is secondary to itself: A kind of 'Zarathustra' complex, if you will.
To understand what is occurring now in a historical context, given that Bin-Laden symbolizes and embodies the
most distorted and extreme forms of Islam, is to understand that the basis of what motivates him is a time in the
past when the Islamic religion reigned supreme. This was called the Islamic Empire, which begin in the middle of
750 AD and ended in the middle of 1258 AD. Bin-Laden's desire is to have Islam reign supreme again. He views
the West, America and all that it embodies as 'alien' in terms of values, beliefs, moralities and ethics. He blames
the U.S. for 'invading' and 'subverting' the current Islamic world: thus, it must be destroyed.
Of course, he fails to remember that the cause of the demise of the original Islamic empire was itself based on
competing groups within it who held different points of view from one another, different interpretations of the
Koran and the values, ethics, and moralities that these imply, and, of course, the self-interest of these competing
groups, which were themselves motivated by the desire for power. Islam's own 'fall from grace' was based on this
fact of the competing factions that determined its destruction. Within this, for hundreds of years, it attempted to
export its religion and its inherent lifestyle, relative to values and moralities, into other regions in an ever
increasing circle.
Interestingly enough, the 'birth chart' that correlates with the beginning of the Islamic Empire has its South Node
in Pisces and its North Node in Virgo conjunct Mars, which is conjunct the U.S.'s natal Neptune. The Islamic
Empire's Neptune is conjunct the U.S.'s natal Mars. And, of course, the natal Mars of the Islamic Chart squares the
Mars of the Natal U.S.'s chart. The event of September 11, 2001, was triggered by the transiting Lucifer over the
Neptune of the U.S.'s chart, which was the former North Node of the birth chart for the Islamic Empire and also
the natal Lucifer for Bin-Laden, his Lucifer return. If the birth data of Bin-Laden is correct, it also places his Sun
and Moon on the birth chart for the Islamic Empire.
In the end, the destruction of this Islamic Empire correlated with the transit of Pluto, then in Sagittarius, over its
natal Jupiter, and the transiting South Node was also in Sagittarius.
In the beginning of this Empire, the original orientation to others--the Christians, the Jews, etc.--was one of
accommodation and tolerance. By the end there was none. And, at the end of the Islamic Empire, the competing
factions within it were blaming everyone but themselves for the troubles of the times. Scapegoats were
everywhere. During this time Christianity was on an ascending arc, and it spread itself progressively thru its
missionaries and its own religious wars that forced people to convert to it. Both religions had this in common.
To me, it is clear that Bin-Laden was part of the time of the Islamic Empire as it was destroyed, and he now
desires to bring it all back in its most extreme and distorted forms. He lives in Afghanistan, and we can see how
that form of Islam is manifesting there. He is looking for scapegoats to attack whom he identifies as being the
reason that prevented the resurrection of Islam to its old glory and dominance in the world, and that scapegoat is
the U.S. and its religions, specifically, its secular lifestyles and 'moderate' religions, and beliefs, including the
unspeakable: women dare to be equal to men! What will humble the U.S., as we have seen in the airplanes
crashing into the buildings, given the tremendous military might, is that the means used by Bin-Laden, the AntiChrist, will be asymmetric: planes used as bombs, car bombs, and the worst of all, biological warfare, with one
person or more releasing biological agents within U.S. cities. In the end, there will be no way that this can be
stopped or protected against if these people intend to do this.
As the current transit of Pluto progresses further into Sagittarius and the South Node of the Moon soon moves into
Sagittarius, Pluto will form a square to the natal Neptune in Virgo of the U.S. chart and oppose Mars in Gemini at
the same time. These are the symbols that could correlate to the release of biological agents, and specifically,
agents that act upon the nervous system: Gemini-Virgo symbols, with Pluto, of course, the cataclysm. If the
biological agents are released by the agents of evil, you can imagine what will occur within this country individually
and collectively. It will go beyond the physical to the psychological: mass hysteria, mass panic, the potential of
neighbor turning against neighbor, who gets the vaccines if made, who doesn't, who is the 'enemy', who isn't, and
on and on. This would certainly 'adjust' the collective attitude towards the rest of the world, adjust our attitude
towards ourselves. No more 'Zarathustra' syndrome, with the acute sense of vulnerability being the cause of its
removal.
From another point of view, let us remember before this madness occurred, Bush and his crowd had a 'screw it'
attitude towards the rest of the world. "We can go it alone; we are the masters of our own destiny" (North Node in
Leo in the U.S. chart). The basic policy was unilateral, isolationist and nationalistic. There was an effort to create a
false justification of its 'missile defense policy,' snubbing its nose at the world's environmental needs and the

desires to bring it all back in its most extreme and distorted forms. He lives in Afghanistan, and we can see how
that form of Islam is manifesting there. He is looking for scapegoats to attack whom he identifies as being the
reason that prevented the resurrection of Islam to its old glory and dominance in the world, and that scapegoat is
the U.S. and its religions, specifically, its secular lifestyles and 'moderate' religions, and beliefs, including the
unspeakable: women dare to be equal to men! What will humble the U.S., as we have seen in the airplanes
crashing into the buildings, given the tremendous military might, is that the means used by Bin-Laden, the AntiChrist, will be asymmetric: planes used as bombs, car bombs, and the worst of all, biological warfare, with one
person or more releasing biological agents within U.S. cities. In the end, there will be no way that this can be
stopped or protected against if these people intend to do this.
As the current transit of Pluto progresses further into Sagittarius and the South Node of the Moon soon moves into
Sagittarius, Pluto will form a square to the natal Neptune in Virgo of the U.S. chart and oppose Mars in Gemini at
the same time. These are the symbols that could correlate to the release of biological agents, and specifically,
agents that act upon the nervous system: Gemini-Virgo symbols, with Pluto, of course, the cataclysm. If the
biological agents are released by the agents of evil, you can imagine what will occur within this country individually
and collectively. It will go beyond the physical to the psychological: mass hysteria, mass panic, the potential of
neighbor turning against neighbor, who gets the vaccines if made, who doesn't, who is the 'enemy', who isn't, and
on and on. This would certainly 'adjust' the collective attitude towards the rest of the world, adjust our attitude
towards ourselves. No more 'Zarathustra' syndrome, with the acute sense of vulnerability being the cause of its
removal.
From another point of view, let us remember before this madness occurred, Bush and his crowd had a 'screw it'
attitude towards the rest of the world. "We can go it alone; we are the masters of our own destiny" (North Node in
Leo in the U.S. chart). The basic policy was unilateral, isolationist and nationalistic. There was an effort to create a
false justification of its 'missile defense policy,' snubbing its nose at the world's environmental needs and the
Kyoto treaty, and on and on. Now, because of this madness, the U.S. must form alliances with many other
countries and lands in its effort to create a sustained war against the evil-motivated terrorism that exists in lands
other than just Afghanistan. It is a nation among other nations that are focused upon the same cause for the same
reasons. Other nations suffer at the hands of terrorism, and now the typical American is forced into awareness and
union with fellow human beings who are subjected to this.
Interesting enough, during the past few days when all the presidents of the world joined together in morning at a
church, for the first time there were speakers from all religions, including Islam. This goes back to the beginning of
the original Islamic Empire when tolerance was the rule of the day, when there was room for all. It is coming full
circle, and it forces Bush and the people he represents and symbolizes in the U.S. to look beyond the nose of their
own self-interest, of their own righteous and pious drivel as symbolized by the religious right in this country. At
this time, the transit of Uranus in conjunction to the natal Moon and Lucifer of the U.S. chart forces the U.S. to
become a Bearer of Light for 'good' by joining in with the rest of what is 'good', God, in the totality of humanity
(Aquarius), for what is good for the majority of all of humanity. What is good is the removal of evil--the roots of
evil--if possible. God, good, always will win, and it will win again.
(Q): Can you please give us the chart data that you used for the "birth chart" of the Islamic Empire?
(A): For the beginning of the Islamic empire use 750 A.D. in Mecca, Saudi Arabia. A good date to use is July 1st.
The end of the Empire is 1258 in Baghdad, again, using the date of July 1st.
U.S. Karma
(Q): I was rereading the first volume of Pluto and came across your note regarding the U.S.'s Pluto in Capricorn:
that one day our nation will fall from grace and become simply one nation among many (as opposed to the
superpower we now are). Could this possibly occur when Pluto transits the U.S.'s Pluto in Capricorn in the next 20
years or so? Is it too early to tell what the timeline is for the U.S. finally realizing equality with other nations?
(A): It is already underway in many ways, and will continue via a variety of earth scenarios, political scenarios,
and disease scenarios, all leading to that effect. The timing, of course, is the Pluto transit relative to the U.S.'s
natal Pluto, as it moves toward a Pluto return.
Karma of Dishonesty
(Q): I have a few questions regarding the karma of dishonesty as found in composite charts.
First, is the main planetary signature that reflects a karma of dishonesty between two people is a heavy eighth
house emphasis? Or, Scorpio/ninth house placements (and/or Sagittarius/eighth house placements)? Pluto, Mars,
and Venus are most relevant in assessing such karma, yes?
(A): The archetype of honesty and truthfulness is a Jupiter, Sagittarius, and ninth house thing; and, of course, the
flip side of honesty is dishonesty or exaggeration or embellishment or 'white lies, which are also reflected in those
archetypes. An eighth house emphasis in composite, of itself, does not always and necessarily mean a karma of
dishonesty. On the other hand, it can--mainly thru not being honest about intentions, motivations, or
psychological agendas.
(Q): Second, in terms of helping to heal the karma of dishonesty in the present life, is the solution as simple as
one person simply admitting true feelings to the other, even if the other does not want to hear/accept the other's
reality?
(A): Yes, and understanding that honesty will always lead to the right reality even when that honesty hurts.
(Q): If so, does such a simple act set up a better dynamic for the next life in which the people will meet? Can one
person's choice to be honest with the other somehow set an example for the other, so that when the relationship
picks up in the next lifetime, there is less of a problem with dishonesty and hidden feelings?
(A): That is the intention, yes. It does not guarantee that the 'other' will follow this lead of honesty though. That
remains to be a free choice thing. On the other hand, if that meeting in the next life does occur, then it does mean
that that other has embraced that lesson and wishes, desires, to carry on via and thru the vehicle of honesty.
(Q): You wrote that if another meeting occurred in the next life, then the other person/Soul has accepted the first
person's intention to manifest honesty in the relationship. Does this mean that the people/Souls will not reunite
again in a future life if one rejects the other's intention for honesty?
(A): Yes, if the declared intention is a desire to be totally honest in all things, then this reunion would not occur
until and unless the other was prepared for that honesty.
monday