Cruise Ship Drummer!: Mel Lewis on cymbals http://www.cruiseshipdrummer.com/2013/05/mel-lewis-on-c...

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Mel Lewis on cymbals

More on cymbals from Mel Lewis's 1985 Modern About the author
Drummer interview. This is pretty much the bible of the Todd Bishop
subject, as it relates to jazz: Portland, Oregon, United States
I'm a jazz drummer, drum
teacher, band leader, and visual
Number and type artist from Portland, Oregon.
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The average drummer usually uses two to four
cymbals. To have any more than that is totally
unnecessary, because where are you going to My major links
put them anyway, and how are you going to Drum instruction in Portland, Oregon
reach them? They shouldn't be there just for Todd Bishop Group
looks. I notice that most people have crash, Email Todd
crash, splash, ride, and hi-hat. Very few young
drummers play on their hihats, except in the
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rock situation where they generally play them
closed and they play their 8th-note beat on
them. They should learn that the hihat is another
ride cymbal to be played properly"ta, da-ka, ta, da-ka, ta," changing
rhythms and all that, open/closed, all open, half open, half closed. There are
a lot of effects. To me, the hi-hat is another ride cymbal.
Click the image to email, or message me at
Every cymbal I use is a ride cymbal. Every one of my cymbals is also a crash
Skype ID todd6ishop!
cymbal. I only use three. Three is enough.

But every cymbal should be a ride cymbal and every cymbal should be a Purchase our books and CDs
crash cymbal. I've been noticing that almost everyone has only one ride
Click the images to order:
cymbal and a million crash cymbals. You don't need the crash cymbals. You
need the ride cymbals, because that's where your whole thing is coming from.
Crash cymbals are only for accents, so you can hit any cymbal for a crash. NEW CD for 2014: Travelogue

Dark

I find that all the cymbals should be dark. If you want a high-pitched splash
cymbal or crash cymbal, fine. That's to your own taste. But darker cymbals
are more complementary to horns than any other kind of cymbal.
High-pitched cymbals have a tendency to obliterate high sounds.

The more high-pitched cymbals you have, the more trouble you're going to
give the band. Also, for riding in a big band, I think that the pingier a cymbal is
and the less overtone and spread it has, the more empty everything will be.
It's important that you have a good, full, fat-sounding cymbal. Finding
cymbals like that today seems to be a problem. They are all too heavy. click cover image to purchase download, or
Definition is one thing, but those pings do not cut through. There has to be a scroll down to "support the blog" to purchase
little more sound to a cymbal than they're creating right now. They've CD
forgotten how to make ride cymbals with color. They don't know what dark
sound is. That's why I still like the old K.'s. They're hard to find, but it seems
New CSD! book: Book of the Blog
like they are the only cymbal that was made for music.
2013

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Cruise Ship Drummer!: Mel Lewis on cymbals http://www.cruiseshipdrummer.com/2013/05/mel-lewis-on-c...

Orchestrating cymbals for big band

[W]hen you hit a high crash cymbal with the brass section while they're up in
that high register, you will knock out half their sound. But if you hit a cymbal
that will blend with that sectionin other words, if there are four trumpets and
the fourth is playing the lowest part, you should be the fifth trumpet, which is
lower yet. Now of course, we can't go that low all the time, but that's the way
I'm thinking musically. Trombones, of course, can go lower than my cymbals
can, so I want to be somewhere in the middle register where I don't obliterate
the lead and I don't destroy the bottom.

With the saxophones, you want a roaring sound to envelop, because reeds
don't have the power that the brass has. That's why I believe that during a
sax soli where you have five saxophone players standing up playing
togethernothing sounds better behind them than a Chinese ride cymbal,
because there's a blend. Bass violin players love Chinese cymbals because
the low sound and the Oriental type of roar make the bass sound spring
122 pages of blog items from 2013. Pages o'
forward. That's why, when we play big ensembles, I'll go to that cymbal, and
coordination, transcriptions, jazz, funk, Latin,
you can hear the bass just singing through everything. When you've got a odd meters, metric modulation, much more!
whole ensemble, you want a strong, enveloping, low sound with a lot of clarity
as far as the beat is concerned. It's like a picture with a beautiful metal frame
around it. It gives tremendous fullness to the sound of the band. CSD! BOOK: 100 Grooves

Continued after the break:

That's why I prefer the darker sounding cymbals and that is why I tell every
drummer, "Every cymbal you have should be a ride cymbal, because you
should treat the different sections with a different ride behind it." There is
nothing worse than the monotony of one cymbal going on behind everything.
When the band is playing along and they keep hearing the same cymbal
sound, it just disappears in their minds. But when you make a change to
another ride cymbal, it wakes them up again.

Even in my dark sounds there is still a higher sound, a medium sound, and a Over 100 drum grooves, as played by some of
the greatest drummers ever. Funk, Latin, jazz,
lower sound. I'll use the high sound behind a piano. I'll also use the lowest
odd meters, much more!
sound behind a piano. But I won't use the middle sound behind the piano
because it's too much in the piano's range. Behind the piano, a flute, or a
muted trumpet, I'll also use the hi-hats or brushes. When I'm playing behind, Get Vol. 1 of the 2011 Book of the Blog!
say, a trumpet solo followed by a tenor solo, and I know that the tenor player
is a hard-blower, I'll use the Chinese cymbal behind the tenor. Now, if it's just
going to be a trumpet solo, or if the tenor player has a lighter sound, I'll use
my normal 20" ride cymbal. But I'll always save my Chinese for the hardest
blowing soloist.

I don't work it out; it's just automaticwhich cymbal suits which soloist. I want
to have a low cymbal behind a soloist who has a harsh, high sound. With a
subdued type of player who has a softer edge, I don't want something that
strong, so I go to a lighter, higher sound to complement it. When the band is
roaring, for main ensemble work, I would stick with my 20" ride or I would use
my hi-hats and really lay into them, which was the norm in the old days
anyway. If it's an ensemble that keeps building, then when I hit the final
loudest point, I'll go to the Chinese.

So I might play three cymbals in the course of an ensemble. If you have three
choruses of ensemble which is rarethe first chorus is not going to be that
Now discounted 15%! 139 pages of
shouting. It's going to build to that. The second one is going to be stronger so
transcriptions of your favorite drummers: Elvin,
you change cymbals. Then you go to the roarer for your last one.
Tony, Dejohnette, Haynes, Vinnie, and many,
many more!
Another thing I've found is that it's good to change cymbals on the bridge of
tunes and then go back. A bridge is a musical change, so your cymbals
should be a musical change also. If it's the first chorus, I'll play Get Little Played Little Bird

hi-hats for 16 bars, go to a light ride cymbal for the bridge, and then go back
to the hi-hats to finish it out. Then I'll go to my chosen ride cymbal for the
solo.

As and Ks

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Cruise Ship Drummer!: Mel Lewis on cymbals http://www.cruiseshipdrummer.com/2013/05/mel-lewis-on-c...

At the time of the interview, hand-hammered, K-type cymbals were only beginning to be
widely commercially available again, after being difficult to find for a decade or more. The
older A. Zildjians Lewis refers to were generally thinner and less clean/bright than modern
ones since approximately the later 1960's.

The old A's were toothe old ones. But today, they're thinking in terms of
loudness and durability rather than musicality. I know what I'm talking about
because I hear the complaints from everybody. I see it in your magazine here.
Everybody's complaining about the cymbalsthat they're all too heavy. Even
the famous rock players are complaining that they can't find enough colors in
their cymbals, but that they would really like to find some. And everybody
wants to have an old K. There's a reason for that. I've been playing original K. and other CDs by Todd Bishop
Zildjian cymbals practically all my life.

The early hand-me-downs from my father were all K.'s, because that's what Support the blog.
he used. Then I bought my first A., which I still have to this day. That's the
Purchase CDs by Todd Bishop
famous one with the pieces cut out. Buddy Rich says it's probably the
Todd Bishop Group Travelogue $14.95 USD
greatest ride cymbal of all time. I feel the same way about it. Everybody
seems to know that cymbal. Of course, it's reached a point in its life where I
can only use it occasionally, so I just use it for small-group recordings now,
because it's starting to crack again, but it still has its flavor. That would have
been considered a bad A. in its time and it would be considered a horrible A.
today because it was low pitch and a real medium weight, but that came from Or download Todd's CDs from Bandcamp.
my K. ears.
Or donate:
Later on, when I came to New York, I used A.'s for a while. All my A.'s were
really considered by most people as not very good. They were all low pitched,
but they had definition. Bandleaders I worked for were always complaining
about themthat they spread too much and so onbut that was what I liked.
You either took me as I was or that was that. When I joined the Kenton band,
Followers
I needed to use A.'s because they are louder and I needed the volume. So I
stayed with the A.'s there for a while. One of my ride cymbals was that Join this site
famous one, with two rivets in it, which is my trademark. To this day, I've been with Google Friend Connect
using two rivets in my ride cymbal. Of course, as soon as I left the Kenton Members (85) More
band I switched to K.'s completely. That was the end of '56. With my
small-group playing, actually, I was using K.'s all along, but I became a
permanent K. player from '56 on.

For more background on Lewis, this Modern Drummer piece by Rick Mattingly is highly
recommended.
Posted by Todd Bishop at 9:37 AM
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Labels: big band, cymbals, interview, jazz, Mel Lewis, Modern Drummer, performance practices,
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3 comments:
Comments
Julius said...
Mel's heyday was nearly fifty years ago. Jazz evolved before his time, and after his
time. Do you think his comments are relevant to eras other than his? Browse by popular topics:

I guess all I'm trying to say is that Mel's position seems a little dogmatic. best books (25)
downloads (270)
8:44 AM
drums (324)
Frankie Dunlop (8)
Todd Bishop said... interview (48)
I think, if anything, popular opinion (in jazz, at least) has come around to his way of Joey Baron (11)
thinking today everyone uses thinnish, dark cymbals. At the time of the interview, he
Keith Jarrett (10)
was considered to be a little bit of a throwback. His suggestions about orchestrating
cymbals for the lead instrument are really timeless we still have to accompany those odd meters (51)
same instruments and make them sound good. Papa Jo Jones (8)
Paul Motian (24)
He was an opinionated guy, and could be kind of abrasive in how he expressed
performance practices (52)
himself, but which parts do you disagree with?
podcast (8)
9:47 AM
polyrhythms (14)
practice (19)
Julius said... practice loops (2)
I don't necessarily disagree with Mel. In fact the point about complementing and not practicing (25)
overshadowing the rest of the band or the soloist is near to my heart. And let me state
samba (37)
for the record I'm no authority on drums or drumming :)

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Cruise Ship Drummer!: Mel Lewis on cymbals http://www.cruiseshipdrummer.com/2013/05/mel-lewis-on-c...

Stick Control (16)

But it makes me sad whenever a respected figure states firmly that "this is the way it
syncopation (51)
should be". To me that encourages conformity and restricts self-expression. But in all
likelihood someone apt to break the rules would ignore Mel anyway. teaching (10)
This / Not This (7)
Love your blog, btw. Thanks for all the informative stuff. Todd's Methods (42)
10:55 AM Tony Williams (21)
transcribing (3)
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transcription (110)
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Mel Lewis on cymbals
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