Frazier Claiborne Sectoin 341 Meeting

IN THE UNITED STATES BANKRUPTCY COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF MISSISSIPPI
IN RE:
HARRIS CLAIBORNE FRAZIER CASE NO. 08-03051-EE
CHAPTER 7 SECTION 341 MEETING

HELD ON MARCH 11, 2009
APPEARANCES:
Eileen Shaffer for BancorpSouth

Drew Malone for Egan Construction
Robert Kisselburgh for Holly Hughes
Billy Brunt for BankFirst
Breck Hines and Scott Holmes for Hines
John Laws for Laws Construction
John Lyle for Acoustics, Inc.
TRUSTEE: Derek A. Henderson
TRANSCRIBED BY: Sherry L. Purvis, CSR #1566

Certified Court Reporter
134 Mallard Pointe Drive
Madison, Mississippi 39110
(601) 605-0229
Section 341 Meeting - 03/11/2009 2
1 INDEX
2
3 Style and Appearances 1
4 Index 2-3
5 Certificate of Court Reporter 65
6
7 EXAMINATIONS
8
9 Examination by Trustee 4
10 Introduction of Parties Present 5
11 Continued Examination by Trustee 6
12 Examination by Ms. Shaffer 20
13 Examination by Mr. Kisselburgh 24
14 Examination by Mr. Brunt 30
15 Examination by Mr. Hines 31
17 Examination by Mr. Laws 41
19 Continued Examination by Mr. Laws 42
22 Examination by Mr. Lyle 50
23 Continued Examination by Mr. Hines 51
24 Examination by Mr. Malone 52
25 Continued Examination by Mr. Brunt 53
Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 EXAMINATIONS
2
3 Continued Examination by Mr. Kisselburgh 55
5 Continued Examination by Mr. Brunt 58
6 Continued Examination of Mr. Kisselburgh 59
7 Trustee's Questions to Various Attendees 59
8 Continued Examination of Trustee 61
9 Continued Examination of Mr. Kisselburgh 62
10 Continued Examination of Trustee 63
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25

1 TRUSTEE: All right. Next I've got Harris

2 Claiborne Frazier. Have a seat. If y'all are going to
3 ask questions, you might want to move up, so you can be
4 heard on the recorder. That's good. Just leave it there
5 for a minute. Sit over there, too, if you need to. Jim
6 Martin was coming back? Was he?
7 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm here on behalf of
8 (unintelligible).
9 TRUSTEE: Okay. All right. I'm sorry. I'm
10 just getting all of this out of the way that I don't need
11 today, I don't think. Okay. Would you raise your right
12 hand, please?
13 HARRIS CLAIBORNE FRAZIER,
14 having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified
15 as follows:
16 EXAMINATION BY TRUSTEE:
17 Q. And you are Harris Claiborne Frazier?
18 A. Correct.
19 Q. Okay. Mr. Frazier, this is your passport; is
20 that correct?
21 A. Correct.
22 Q. And you don't have a driver's license; is that
23 right?
24 A. I do. It's just misplaced.
25 Q. Okay. All right. Social security number is

1 the same that's listed here?

2 A. Correct.
3 Q. Okay. And it is the same number that's listed
4 on this notice here, so I'm going to give that back to --
5 A. All --
6 Q. -- you.
7 A. -- right.
8 TRUSTEE: All right. I'm going to start around
9 on this side, and ask who's present.
10 MS. SHAFFER: Eileen Shaffer for BancorpSouth.
11 TRUSTEE: Okay. Bancorp. All right.
12 MR. MALONE: Drew Malone for Egan Construction.
13 MR. KISSELBURGH: Robert Kisselburgh for Holly
14 Hughes.
15 TRUSTEE: Spell that, please, sir.
16 MR. KISSELBURGH: K-I-S-S-E-L-B-U-R-G-H.
17 TRUSTEE: Okay. And you represent --
18 MR. KISSELBURGH: Holly --
19 TRUSTEE: -- Holly?
20 MR. KISSELBURGH: -- Hughes.
21 MR. BRUNT: I'm Billy Brunt, BankFirst.
22 MR. LINDSEY: Talbert (phonetic) Lindsey
23 (phonetic), BankFirst.
24 MR. HINES: Breck Hines and Scott Holmes on
25 behalf of Hines-Phillips, R. Scott Hines, Shirley Hines.

1 Who else?
2 TRUSTEE: Okay. Behind you?
3 MR. LAWS: John Laws, Laws Construction.
4 TRUSTEE: Okay. I can't -- this lady's with
5 you?
6 MR. LAWS: My wife.
7 MR. LYLE: John Lyle, Acoustics, Inc.
8 TRUSTEE: Okay. Anybody else? All right.
9 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY TRUSTEE:
10 Q. Mr. Frazier, did you provide the information to
11 your attorney for the preparation of your bankruptcy
12 schedules?
13 A. I did.
14 Q. Is the information listed here true and
15 correct?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Have you listed all of your assets?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. And have you listed all of your liabilities?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Have you transferred any property, real or
22 personal, to anyone in the past two years?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Okay. And I'm showing here on your statement
25 of financial affairs -- item number ten shows Amy Atwood

1 Frazier -- you had in August of 2008 various things

2 through a divorce decree; is that correct?
3 A. Correct.
4 Q. Okay. And then I'm showing Amy Atwood Frazier
5 in 2007, transfer equity in marital home prior to the
6 divorce; is that correct?
7 A. Correct. It was -- it was not transferred to
8 her, though. It was transferred to her father.
9 Q. Okay. And that was in '07?
10 A. Correct.
11 Q. All right. And then you've got Shelby
12 Brantley, M.D. and others, an interest in Six Shooter Land
13 and Timber, October '06?
14 A. Correct.
15 Q. And then, also, to Shelby Brantley, M.D. and
16 others, October '06, a two-thirds interest in Frazier
17 Development's 50 percent warehouse building, Flowood; is
18 that correct?
19 A. It's not. It's -- it's 50 percent interest in
20 a warehouse development in Flowood.
21 Q. Okay. But Frazier Development had a two-thirds
22 interest in the 50 percent --
23 A. Of --
24 Q. -- is that not right?
25 A. It's not.

1 Q. Okay. It's just --

2 A. Frazier Development had 50 percent interest in
3 the Flowood Development.
4 Q. Okay. All right. Other than those four
5 transfers that are listed here, have there been any other
6 transfers?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Okay. Did you review an information sheet with
9 your attorney regarding bankruptcy?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. All right. Have you filed bankruptcy before?
12 A. Not personally.
13 Q. The company -- which company had filed
14 bankruptcy?
15 A. Frazier Development filed, but it was
16 dismissed.
17 Q. It was Chapter 11, wasn't it, and it was
18 dismissed as an 11; is that --
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. -- correct? Okay. Now, this was a year ago?
21 A. Year and a half.
22 Q. Year and a half. Okay. And I've got an
23 address on you of Grandview Circle, Brandon; is that still
24 a good address?
25 A. No.

1 Q. What's your address now?

2 A. 775 Gulf Shore Drive, and that's Destin,
3 Florida 32541.
4 Q. All right. You'll need to get your attorney,
5 Mr. Curtis, to get that address changed with the court, so
6 that any notices that come out of the court will be
7 mailed --
8 A. Okay.
9 Q. -- to that address, to be certain you get a
10 copy of --
11 A. Okay.
12 Q. -- everything. Okay. All right. Did you sign
13 this petition when it was filed?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. And did you sign the schedules?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Did you review the information before you
18 signed it?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Do you need to make any changes or corrections
21 of any kind?
22 A. None, other than what we just made.
23 Q. Okay. All right. On the transfers we --
24 A. On --
25 Q. -- talked --

1 A. -- the --
2 Q. -- about?
3 A. -- transfers, right.
4 Q. All right. Are you involved in any lawsuits in
5 which you were suing someone, or do you have any claims
6 against anyone?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Okay. What are they?
9 A. Against Rossini restaurant, Dale Danks. I have
10 a claim against them that will evolve into a lawsuit.
11 Q. Personally?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. Okay. And when you say Dale Danks, is he
14 someone you have a claim against, also, over the Rossini
15 restaurant?
16 A. Right. He's the owner of the restaurant and
17 had signed the lease.
18 Q. Okay. All right. Other than that?
19 A. None.
20 Q. All right. Do you have an attorney that you've
21 already hired to pursue this claim against Dale Danks and
22 the Rossini restaurant?
23 A. I do.
24 Q. And who is that?
25 A. John Wakeland.

1 Q. Okay. Did you sign a contract with him, or is

2 he just working by the hour or --
3 A. Contract.
4 Q. I'll get in touch with him. I know John
5 Wakeland. Okay. All right. I'm going to go over the
6 land that you got listed here. All right. Six Shooter
7 Lodge -- debtor has a 16.6 interest in the lodge itself,
8 right?
9 A. Correct.
10 Q. Okay. And has this been transferred, though,
11 also?
12 A. No.
13 Q. No. All right. Well, what's the deal with
14 Shelby Brantley and others on that transfer of Six Shooter
15 Land and Timber? Two different things?
16 A. It's two -- two different things, but it's the
17 same camp. The lodge is the lodge and eight acres, which
18 is Six Shooter Lodge, which is one company. And Six
19 Shooter Land and Timber is another company that owns
20 2,500 acres.
21 Q. All right. I know some of this. I'm just
22 clarifying it --
23 A. Right.
24 Q. -- on the record, so --
25 A. I understand.

1 Q. -- we'll get it clear. Okay. All right. And

2 then there's a debt on that, also; is that correct -- on
3 the lodge itself?
4 A. Correct.
5 Q. All right. But then you've got Mathena
6 Wetlands in Belzoni, six acres and a lodge?
7 A. That's misprinted. It's 550 acres, and -- and
8 there's a building. It's not a lodge.
9 Q. Okay. And there's a debt on that, also?
10 A. No.
11 Q. All right. What is it? Is that a hunting
12 camp?
13 A. It is.
14 Q. Do you own it 100 percent yourself?
15 A. No.
16 Q. Who owns it? How much do you own?
17 A. 20 percent.
18 Q. Okay. Who owns the other 80 percent?
19 A. Four other individuals.
20 Q. Okay. And who are they?
21 A. Larry Edwards. There's an Austin Frazier, my
22 brother.
23 Q. Right.
24 A. There's a Shelby Brantley and a Doug Hutchins.
25 Q. And I'm assuming 20 percent by everybody?

1 A. Correct.
2 Q. Okay. All right. Mathena Wetlands has nothing
3 to do with Six Shooter? They're two separate pieces of
4 property?
5 A. Correct.
6 Q. Okay. And there is no mortgage on that 550
7 acres?
8 A. None.
9 Q. Okay. Colonial (sic) Crossing, which is 121
10 Colonial Crossing, Madison. What is in your name
11 individually?
12 A. Let me -- that must be a misprint. It's Colony
13 Crossing.
14 Q. It is Colony. I said Colonial. I'm sorry.
15 A. And we own -- Frazier Development owns
16 50 percent, and I own two-thirds of Frazier Development.
17 Q. I got you. All right. And Ergon owns the
18 other 50 percent?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. Okay. And what's happened with -- who's
21 managing that now? Has Ergon taken that over and is
22 managing that?
23 A. We jointly do it.
24 Q. Okay. Who at Ergon is your contact person that
25 runs this?

1 A. On the property management side is a Keith

2 Clair.
3 Q. Know Keith.
4 A. But the partner in the development is a Robert
5 Lampton.
6 Q. Know --
7 A. He's --
8 Q. -- Robert.
9 A. -- the president of Ergon Properties, which
10 actually holds the -- the 50 percent of interest of
11 Frazier Development.
12 Q. All right. But when you talk about managing
13 the property and the income coming in and paying the note,
14 Keith Clair's handling that? That's who you deal with?
15 A. He -- he deals with the property management,
16 actually. Paying the note is another guy at Ergon named
17 Ken Hodges.
18 Q. All right. What happens to the rents that come
19 in every month? Where do they go?
20 A. They go to Ergon Properties.
21 Q. Okay. And you have that agreement with Ergon
22 that that's been handled that way?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Okay. And who do you talk to at Ergon if you
25 want to discuss the rents coming in and the notes getting

1 paid? Is that Keith Clair or Ken Hodges?

2 A. Both.
3 Q. Both. Okay. All right. Who owns the other
4 one-third interest of Frazier Development?
5 A. My father.
6 Q. What's his name?
7 A. C. E. Frazier.
8 Q. Okay. All right. The next is the Six Shooter
9 Lodge, which is the lodge itself that you told me about
10 earlier, right?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. This has got land. It says transferred in
13 October 2006. So, actually, it's called the Six Shooter
14 Lodge, but it's really talking about land itself? That's
15 the --
16 A. That's the --
17 Q. -- twenty --
18 A. -- correct.
19 Q. -- five hundred acres, right?
20 A. Right.
21 Q. And that is the same property that we discussed
22 on the number ten that had been transferred back in
23 October of '06?
24 A. Correct.
25 Q. Okay. And then we've got the warehouse,

1 Flowood. And it says assigned 50 percent, 2006, Frazier

2 Development as 50 percent; is that --
3 A. That's correct.
4 Q. All right. Okay. So Frazier Development
5 had -- you own 50 percent, and Frazier Development owned
6 50 percent, and you transferred your personal 50 percent?
7 Is that what you're saying?
8 A. Actually, in the Flowood part, I -- Frazier
9 Development owned 50 percent.
10 Q. Uh-huh (affirmative).
11 A. The other 50 percent was held by a Steve
12 Davidson.
13 Q. Okay. So Steve Davidson and Frazier
14 Development were 50 percent owners, and you have
15 two-thirds interest in Frazier Development? And you gave
16 your interest of two-thirds in Frazier Development's 50
17 percent -- that's what was transferred to Shelby Brantley
18 and others; is that -- did I follow that right?
19 A. Almost. We actually transferred our -- Frazier
20 Development -- the entire 50 --
21 Q. Oh --
22 A. -- percent.
23 Q. -- okay. All right. So your father, in his
24 one-third, gave, also, and it went to Shelby Brantley?
25 A. Correct. And I want to point out it was the

1 intent on the Flowood Development to satisfy debt, but it

2 only satisfied about 85 to 90 percent of the debt --
4 A. -- so we -- the balance of the debt, we
5 collateralized with the Six Shooter land because that was
6 the only property that we had free and clear. And the two
7 other individuals were also in that hunting camp, and so
8 it was my request -- my attorney to set aside the transfer
9 on the land because it's far more valuable than -- than
10 the debt that was owed, so I can sell the Six Shooter
11 membership and satisfy the creditors.
12 Q. Okay. All right. Other than those tracts that
13 I just went over, do you have any land that's in your
14 name?
15 A. No.
16 Q. Okay. All right. And then this 50 percent of
17 Frazier Development -- this two-thirds of the Frazier
18 Development that you own to get the 50 percent -- does
19 Frazier Development have any assets now? What does it own
20 today?
21 A. The only thing Frazier Development still owns
22 is the shopping center in Madison, Colony Crossing, with
23 Ergon.
24 Q. Okay. Which has a debt on it of about
25 $12,000,000; is that correct?

1 A. It's twelve million, seven fifty.

2 Q. Okay. When you say that shopping center -- is
3 the Bonefish and that building and those outparcels also
4 part of this?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Okay. The Wendy's, none of that -- you're
7 talking about the shopping center itself, where the Kroger
8 is and the Beef 'O'Brady's, the whole area there?
9 A. Correct.
10 Q. Okay. All right. What about the 50 percent
11 interest in Flowood Development subject to assignment?
12 I'm not sure --
13 A. That's --
14 Q. -- what --
15 A. -- what --
16 Q. -- that --
17 A. -- we --
18 Q. -- means?
19 A. -- discussed. That's the -- the -- the
20 Flowood -- that's the warehouse development in Flowood
21 that Frazier Development assigned 50 percent back in
22 October of '06 to Steve Davidson. The entity that owned
23 that was Flowood Developers, LLC.
24 Q. I got you. You're just showing that as a
25 potential interest claim that if it comes back -- that's

1 why it's listed --

2 A. I --
3 Q. -- here?
4 A. -- want to -- my intent is to place a value on
5 that, which is actually written at the bottom of the
6 assignment. And -- and -- and get the Six Shooter
7 assignment undone, so I can sell Six Shooter Lodge and
8 land, at it should, as a whole, of which I had buyers
9 lined up, but I hadn't been able to do that for obvious
10 reasons.
11 Q. Okay. All right. What about the Ergon
12 Frazier? What is -- what is that company?
13 A. Ergon Frazier -- the -- the correct name of the
14 entity that owns Colony Crossing Shopping Center is Ergon
15 Frazier Development I, LLC. Frazier Development has
16 50 percent, and Ergon Properties has the other 50 percent.
17 Q. All right. The place that you're living in
18 Destin -- who owns that?
19 A. My mother and my stepfather.
20 Q. Okay. Have they always owned it? It's never
21 been in your name?
22 A. Never been in my name.
23 Q. Okay. Has it been in Frazier Development
24 Company?
25 A. No.

1 Q. Just they've owned it since they bought it?

2 A. Correct.
3 TRUSTEE: Okay. All right. I'll start over
4 here at BancorpSouth. Do you have any questions you want
5 to ask?
6 EXAMINATION BY MS. SHAFFER:
7 Q. Mr. Frazier, Eileen Shaffer on behalf of
8 BancorpSouth. Under what company did you develop the
9 condos in Oxford?
10 A. Van Buren Group, LLC.
11 Q. And did you have an ownership interest in Van
12 Buren, LLC?
13 A. I did.
14 Q. And do you still have that interest?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Okay. How do you see it listed on the
17 bankruptcy schedules?
18 A. It -- it -- it's been so long ago. There's one
19 condo left, and the bank -- and you may be involved in
20 this. There was an Oxford attorney that was working on
21 doing a judicial foreclosure to foreclose on that. We
22 listed BancorpSouth as a creditor. We dissolved Van Buren
23 Group. And, honestly, I don't know if title -- well, I
24 don't know if the title on that condo was actually in
25 Frazier Development, Van Buren Group. I understand that

1 it was sold for taxes, and that's part of the lawsuit

2 between -- between BancorpSouth and some Holly Springs
3 realty, that actually bought it. But we -- we listed
4 BancorpSouth as a creditor with intentions of whatever
5 money may be owed after the -- the -- the credit of this
6 judicial foreclosure on that last condo -- you know, we
7 listed Bancorp as a creditor for that reason.
8 Q. Van Buren was dissolved. Would you say it's
9 been dissolved within the last several years?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. The bankruptcy schedules under statement of
12 financial affairs, question number 18, ask for your
13 ownership interest in any business that you've had within
14 the last six years. I didn't see Van Buren there. Are
15 there any other businesses that you've had an interest in
16 in the last six years that were not disclosed?
17 A. There are several LLCs that were just set up,
18 you know, as real estate holding LLCs. But Frazier
19 Development was -- either owned the LLC in whole or in
20 part. And -- and I'll be -- be glad to go back and amend
21 and -- and list all of those LLCs, but as -- as I
22 understand it, the only thing that Frazier Development
23 still owns is the part -- part of Colony Crossing. The
24 condo in Oxford, from what I'm told, is -- is -- was sold
25 for taxes, and Dana Kelly is the attorney that's kind of

1 been the go between that I've been -- keeping me -- you

2 know, keeping me up to speed as to what's going on.
3 Q. Well, what ownership interest did you have in
4 Van Buren?
5 A. One-third.
6 Q. And who had the other two-thirds?
7 A. Shelby Brantley and a Bob Crumpton.
8 Q. And when you sold those condos, what did you do
9 with the money that you received from the sale?
10 A. It went in Van Buren, and it built the project.
11 Q. And when you said it went to Van Buren, you
12 mean in Van Buren's bank account?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Okay. And where was that bank account located?
15 A. BancorpSouth.
16 Q. And when you sold the various condos, did you
17 get a release from those deeds of trust?
18 A. The majority of them, yes.
19 Q. Did you get a release from the one that was
20 sold to Shane Langston?
21 A. No.
22 Q. Okay. And what did you do with the proceeds
23 from the sale to Mr. Langston?
24 A. Built the project.
25 Q. Okay. So, in other words, you put it in the

1 Van Buren bank accounts?

2 A. Oh, yes.
3 Q. Did you ever put any of these moneys in any
4 other bank account?
5 A. No.
6 Q. What about the property sold to John Dennery?
7 A. I never sold any property to John Dennery.
8 Q. Was a condo sold to John Dennery?
9 A. No.
10 Q. What about the property sold to Jim Greenfield?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. Okay. What did you do with the proceeds from
13 that sale?
14 A. Van Buren.
15 Q. So when you say Van Buren, once again, it went
16 into the bank account of Van --
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. -- Buren? Did any of those proceeds go to
19 BancorpSouth for the release of their deed of trust on
20 that property?
21 A. I'm not sure. Taylor, Covington & Smith was my
22 attorney, Bobby Covington, and he handled that. So I'm --
23 I -- I can't exactly recall, but all of the moneys went
24 into the Van Buren account.
25 Q. And was any property sold to Larry Bryan?

1 A. Yes.
2 Q. And what happened to those proceeds?
3 A. Same thing.
4 Q. Went into the Van Buren account?
5 A. Correct.
6 Q. Mr. Frazier, at this time or at the time when
7 you filed your bankruptcy petition, did you own any guns?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Okay. I didn't see those listed on your
10 bankruptcy schedule. Have you transferred any guns in the
11 last two years?
12 A. No, I have not.
13 Q. If you will also --
14 A. Okay.
15 Q. -- make that amendment, as well.
16 A. I'll be glad to.
17 Q. Thank you. That's all the questions I have.
18 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't have any.
19 TRUSTEE: No questions. Yes, sir.
20 EXAMINATION BY MR. KISSELBURGH:
21 Q. Mr. Frazier, I'm Robert Kisselburgh, and I
22 represent Holly Hughes. You know who she is, don't you?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Okay. And you understand -- did you receive
25 the copy of a order dated March 4th, 2009, from the

1 juvenile court for Williamson County, Tennessee, in the

2 matter of Ella Diane Hughes?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. You understand you have been -- this court has
5 determined that you are the biological father of Ella
6 Diane Hughes?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Okay. And you also understand that you have
9 been ordered to pay certain amounts towards her support?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. And you also understand that a judgement has
12 been entered against you for 100 -- excuse me -- $106,800
13 for back child support in addition to $3,900.06 for
14 medical bills, pertinent expenses, and $9,000 for
15 attorneys' fees? Do you understand that?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Okay. Have you amended your schedule to
18 indicate those amounts owed?
19 A. No. I just got it last night.
20 Q. Okay. Did you receive it before last night?
21 A. I got it -- my attorney might have, and we're
22 working on amending that here in Mississippi. But I just
23 got what you reflected delivered to me last night about
24 6:30.
25 Q. Okay. And where were you staying last night?

1 A. In Brandon.
2 Q. At 79 Grandview Circle?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. Does your wife currently live there?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Okay. So she's living at Grandview Circle in
7 Brandon, and you're living in Destin?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. And I think you gave your address as 775 Gulf
10 Shore Drive?
11 A. Correct.
12 Q. Is there a condo number?
13 A. Yes, 36.
14 Q. Okay. And how long have you been living down
15 there?
16 A. I've been living there part-time since last
17 summer.
18 Q. Okay. Part-time you've been living there, back
19 and forth between here and Mississippi?
20 A. Correct.
21 Q. You still consider yourself to be a resident of
22 the state of Mississippi, correct?
23 A. For the next 30 days, yes. I'm fixing to move
24 down there permanently.
25 Q. Okay. And why?

1 A. My kids are down there.

2 Q. Okay. And is your wife going to move down
3 there?
4 A. She -- oh, yes. My wife is moving down there.
5 Yes.
6 Q. Okay. Are you employed down there?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Okay. Are you employed right at this time?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Okay. How are you living?
11 A. I'm -- my family.
12 Q. Okay. And that includes -- is that your mom
13 that's helping out?
14 A. My mother and my grandmother.
15 Q. Anybody else you're receiving funds from at
16 this time?
17 A. No. I am an independent agent for a company
18 out of Florida, and I am trying to purchase foreclosures.
19 I'm also spotting distressed shopping centers, and I'm
20 backed by a company out of Chicago. Got some deals on the
21 table. They don't pay me hourly. They don't pay me
22 weekly. I just get paid commission. But with the credit
23 crunch, not a whole lot going on right now, but I do have
24 some deals on the table.
25 Q. Well, how many deals have gone through since

1 the time you originally filed the bankruptcy?

2 A. None.
3 Q. Okay. The company you're doing deals with in
4 Florida -- what's the name of that company?
5 A. Americo.
6 Q. Okay. And the company out of Chicago that you
7 do deals with -- what's that company?
8 A. Inland Realty.
9 Q. And do you have an employment contract with
10 either of those companies?
11 A. I do with the Florida company.
12 Q. And who are you working with on the Florida
13 company? Who's your contact?
14 A. It's a company from Vera Cruz (sic), Florida.
15 There's a host of support staff down there. There's about
16 ten of them.
17 Q. Okay. Who do you report to?
18 A. Actually, there's a lady that I submit my
19 contracts to. I can't think of her name. I do it on -- I
20 do it on-line, and I -- I can't think of her name right
21 now.
22 Q. The company out of Chicago that you're doing
23 business with -- who's your contact person there?
24 A. I don't have a contact direct. I have a
25 contact out of Birmingham who was formally with AIG Baker,

1 who has the direct contact with them.

2 Q. Okay. So the person in Birmingham that you
3 have contact with is -- what's their name?
4 A. Bubba Smith.
5 Q. Okay. And whereabouts is -- what's the company
6 he's working for in Birmingham?
7 A. He's kind of like me. He's with AIG Baker,
8 which is a development of AIG Insurance, and it's about to
9 shut down and melt down, and he's doing what I'm doing.
10 Q. Okay. You'd have the ability to get in contact
11 with Bubba Smith, though, wouldn't you?
12 A. Oh, yes, I do.
13 Q. Oh, you said that your mother and your
14 grandmother are currently helping you with monthly
15 spending -- monthly support; is that correct?
16 A. Correct.
17 Q. How much are you receiving on that monthly
18 basis?
19 A. About 1,000.
20 Q. Plus, you're living rent free down at the
21 condo?
22 A. Correct.
23 Q. What are you driving?
24 A. GMC Yukon.
25 Q. That's all we have right now.

1 A. All right.
2 TRUSTEE: Bank First.
3 EXAMINATION BY MR. BRUNT:
4 Q. Claiborne, you mentioned your various and
5 sundry hunting camps and the interest that you own.
6 There's no debt on this place in Belzoni. How come that
7 hadn't been liquidated to your other partners, and the
8 money taken to pay your creditors, with us being one of
9 them?
10 A. None of them -- none of them want to buy it.
11 They know I'm in bankruptcy, and --
12 Q. Have you made an effort to sell it to them?
13 A. I had one creditor approach me to assign it,
14 and I didn't feel like that was the best thing to do. I
15 have listed it with a broker from Memphis. Yes. I've
16 made every effort I could to sell it.
17 Q. All right. What about your interest in Ergon
18 Frazier? Ergon's got big checkbooks. How come you hadn't
19 sold what interest you have left with them and pay your
20 creditors?
21 A. I've tried. I gave them a price that I
22 consider 75 percent of the value when they sold a piece of
23 property downtown here, and they didn't buy.
24 Q. All right. One more question, on your
25 bankruptcy filing, you listed your clothing as $200?

1 A. Right.
2 Q. You've got $200 worth of stuff on right now.
3 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look at the current value.
4 MR. BRUNT: What?
5 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're going to look at the
6 current value of his clothing.
7 MR. BRUNT: I just -- I just asked him.
8 Q. (By Mr. Brunt) $200?
9 A. My -- my --
10 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We wouldn't get that in a
11 garage sale for the clothes you got on right now.
12 MR. BRUNT: That's all the questions I've got.
13 TRUSTEE: Hines?
14 MR. HINES: Yes, sir.
15 EXAMINATION BY MR. HINES:
16 Q. Claiborne, you said earlier the -- your
17 interest in Frazier Development was two-thirds, and your
18 dad owned a third?
19 A. And that's what it's -- currently is.
20 Q. What interest in Frazier Construction did you
21 have or do you have currently?
22 A. None.
23 Q. The various pieces of heavy equipment that are
24 up in Belzoni that are stored at Big Brake Hunting Club --
25 who owns those?

1 A. Frazier Construction.
2 Q. And what about the Kubota tractor in the metal
3 building at Mathena?
4 A. I'm assuming, Frazier Construction.
5 Q. Okay. And are those pledged to anybody as
6 collateral, or does anybody have --
7 A. I don't know.
8 Q. -- liens on them? Big Brake Hunting Camp,
9 being, you know, an exclusive hunting club, you know --
10 who's paying your dues, or how are you --
11 A. My --
12 Q. -- paying those?
13 A. -- my mother paid them.
14 Q. And is she going to continue paying them?
15 A. That's the plan. Yes.
16 Q. I mean, is that -- instead of satisfying
17 creditors, that money can go --
18 A. She -- that's a place when the grandkids come
19 home, but that's -- that's -- she's going to continue --
20 Q. What --
21 A. -- paying --
22 Q. -- about --
23 A. -- them.
24 Q. -- furniture --
25 A. But as you know, Big Brake Hunting Club is for

1 sale, and my stepfather and mother are currently trying to

2 sell their interest.
3 Q. Right. What about the furniture that's in your
4 room at the Big Brake? Who owns that?
5 A. My mother. Let me -- let me rephrase that. I
6 would say my stepfather owns that. He actually -- when
7 that building was built, I want to say that the lodge
8 there -- the buildings are separate, and that that is
9 owned by my stepfather, so --
10 Q. But he actually paid for the furniture in
11 that unit?
12 A. It was purchased when we built that building
13 seven, eight years ago, so I would say that he owns
14 80 percent of it. I wouldn't say all of it. I mean, I
15 can point a couch out that I -- you know, I bought
16 probably five years ago. But most everything in there has
17 been the same since it -- since it was built.
18 Q. Do you have any boats up at Big Brake?
19 A. I've got a 12-foot boat. Yes.
20 Q. What about the boat registered Mississippi 7996
21 Bravo Juliet or Mississippi 0798 Bravo Golf? One's got a
22 outboard, standard outboard, and the other's got a
23 Go-Devil logo on it. Both have been seen in your
24 possession in the last 60 days.
25 A. I don't -- I don't own -- I don't recognize the

1 numbers. But the one with the Go-Devil's my brother's,

2 Austin's.
3 Q. What about the other one that is commonly known
4 up at the hunting camp as your boat? Is it not your boat?
5 A. That's my boat. Yeah. I mean, it -- the
6 12-foot small skiff, yes.
7 Q. Is it listed on the schedule like that?
8 A. No, it's not.
9 Q. What about four-wheelers? You got any --
10 A. I've got --
11 Q. -- four-wheelers?
12 A. -- the one four-wheeler that is -- my
13 stepfather owns that I ride.
14 Q. Is there not a War Eagle boat with
15 (unintelligible) engine on it?
16 A. No. That was sold seven, eight months ago.
17 Q. Okay. Is there any property remaining in
18 Tupelo, any office buildings at the Fair Park Development
19 in Tupelo that you own?
20 A. No.
21 Q. There was two buildings at one point. Stanford
22 Financial purchased one. What happened to the other one?
23 Weren't there two buildings?
24 A. There was an office building that BancorpSouth
25 foreclosed on.

1 Q. And who owns it now?

2 A. I don't know.
3 Q. Did the Hines not have a charging order against
4 the -- against that asset?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Well, I'd like to make it be known that we did,
7 but I don't know what we can do about it here. I can
8 produce that charging order, and you've --
9 A. Let's --
10 Q. -- already --
11 A. -- clarify this. There were two buildings in
12 Tupelo. One we sold to Stanford Financial. The other was
13 an office building that our construction office used to be
14 in that BancorpSouth foreclosed on.
15 Q. How big was it?
16 A. 7,500 square feet. You may be getting
17 confused, Breck. The building downtown had a breezeway
18 through the bottom of it. And I guess someone could look
19 at it and think it's two buildings, but it was one.
20 The --
21 Q. Is --
22 A. -- one --
23 Q. -- that --
24 A. -- that --
25 Q. -- not --

1 A. -- we --
2 Q. -- the Stanford -- Stanford was in both sides,
3 I guess?
4 A. No. They -- they bought the entire building,
5 but they were in one side.
6 Q. In regards to Colony Crossing, there was a
7 bonus fee to be paid, called the Kroger bonus fee that was
8 to be paid to you and Ergon. What happened with that?
9 A. It was due February 28th provided we had leased
10 the 8,000 feet that Kroger bought. We are working with
11 Kroger to try to get that extended. They know we've been
12 trying to lease that space. They understand --
13 Q. None of it's leased right now?
14 A. None of the 8,000 feet that Kroger purchased is
15 leased, as -- as I know it, I mean, as of, you know, two
16 weeks ago.
17 Q. There was also a developer's fee that was being
18 held in Ergon Frazier Development as of January 31st,
19 2007. That amount was $236,616.64 that was -- I believe
20 that belonged to Frazier Development or it belonged to
21 you. What has happened with that money or --
22 A. It's still accruing interest, and Ergon has it,
23 and it's around 285,000 now.
24 Q. What's the -- how come they're holding it and
25 not distributing it?

1 A. It's their decision. They're the manager. I

2 guess, cash calls -- Trustmark just renewed a $12,000,000
3 note for us. It's my contention that I want to hold on to
4 that through my trustee, and -- and sell that back when
5 the market goes up, which may be a year or two. So, you
6 know, they might see fit to -- to -- Ergon to let loose of
7 it, being that Trustmark just renewed that note, and
8 the -- we've -- we've kicked out a lot of tenants that --
9 that hadn't been able to pay rent. And the ones that are
10 paying are paying the -- the new note, the -- the monthly
11 note --
12 Q. But --
13 A. -- with --
14 Q. -- as --
15 A. -- Trustmark?
16 Q. -- of March 1st, is the -- I mean, is the
17 property cash flowing enough to cover the debt service?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. So there's no more cash calls, at least -- when
20 was the last cash call that you remember?
21 A. Two years ago.
22 Q. Do you still own unencumbered the 20 percent
23 interest in Mathena Wetlands, LLC?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Okay. Who owns the metal building there that

1 the tractor is in that's outside of Mathena Wetlands, LLC?

2 A. It's -- it's in Mathena Wetlands -- the land,
3 although my brother and I paid for the metal building --
4 Q. So --
5 A. -- and -- and I do think that once, you know --
6 if -- if you're going -- once the property's sold, I think
7 we should get a little -- a little bit more money than the
8 other partners, being that we paid for that metal
9 building.
10 Q. You don't have any agreement that says that?
11 A. We don't, but -- but the other members of the
12 camp know who paid for that.
13 Q. So if someone were to buy your 20 percent
14 interest, would they be buying the building, as well?
15 A. I would say yes. Yes.
16 Q. Out of that heavy equipment that's being stored
17 up at the Big Brake in Belzoni, there was -- as of 14 days
18 ago, there was a gooseneck trailer included in that, and
19 as of last Sunday, it was not there. Do you know where
20 that went?
21 A. I don't.
22 Q. It just disappeared?
23 A. I have no idea. I don't do anything with the
24 construction equipment.
25 Q. You don't know? Where were you last weekend?

1 A. I was in Florida with my kids.

2 Q. And I understand you've got a new -- fancy new
3 golf cart in Florida?
4 A. I don't.
5 Q. Who paid for that?
6 A. I don't have a golf cart.
7 Q. Well, you were --
8 A. I don't have a golf cart in Florida. I --
9 Q. You were seen driving one. Whose were you seen
10 driving?
11 A. That would have been one that my mother bought.
12 Again, I didn't buy a new golf cart.
13 Q. Okay. And you spent Mardi Gras in New Orleans,
14 I understand?
15 A. I did.
16 Q. Where did you stay while you were down there?
17 A. At the Crowne Plaza.
18 Q. And who paid for that?
19 A. My wife.
20 Q. Okay. Are there any other assets that -- I had
21 a question I was going to ask -- were there any other
22 assets that are not listed on the schedule that you know
23 of?
24 A. No.
25 Q. Thank you.


2 Q. What is Big Brake?
3 A. It's a hunting camp in Belzoni that my
4 stepfather owns with four other guys.
5 Q. Okay. So your -- your -- you don't -- do you
6 have any ownership interest in Big Brake?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Okay. That's different than Mathena Wetlands,
9 right?
10 A. Correct.
11 Q. Okay. All right. You're just a member of the
12 club at Big Brake?
13 A. I'm -- I'm a junior member. My -- the -- the
14 main member is my stepfather.
15 Q. Okay. But you pay dues to be a member of that?
16 A. My mother paid, so that the grandkids could
17 come up.
18 Q. Right. But you don't own any of the land up
19 there? It's not in your name?
20 A. Correct.
21 Q. Never been in your name?
22 A. Correct. And when you say "land up there" --
23 Q. I'm --
24 A. -- Mathena --
25 Q. -- talking about Big Brake.

1 A. Big Brake.
2 Q. Yeah. I'm --
3 A. Okay.
4 Q. -- talking about --
5 A. All right.
6 Q. -- Big Brake only. I just wanted to be sure --
7 A. Because Mathena's --
8 Q. -- it --
9 A. -- about --
10 Q. -- was --
11 A. -- a --
12 Q. -- different.
13 A. -- mile away.
14 THE TRUSTEE: Okay. All right. The Laws?
15 EXAMINATION BY MR. LAWS:
16 Q. What's the status of the loan on Colony
17 Crossing? Did you say it had just been renewed?
18 A. Yeah. We -- to -- to give you my -- my
19 thoughts. The -- the -- the loan, twelve million, seven
20 fifty, was due in December. I had filed in October,
21 and -- and the -- my attorney failed to file a creditor
22 matrix on time, which is the reason this creditor meeting
23 has been pushed back two or three months. Trustmark, I
24 think, wanted to see, you know, if -- if the Trustee was
25 going to force me to sell, or if Ergon was going to buy my

1 interest, and none of that happened. And I let Trustmark

2 know that I'm going to fight as hard as I can to -- to --
3 you know, through the Trustee, stay in the deal and see
4 the real estate market come back up, and -- and sell
5 Colony Crossing, which they saw fit to do that. And they
6 just gave us a -- a new note where we're paying principal
7 and -- and interest.
8 Q. What are the terms of that note?
9 A. I don't want to discuss that. I don't think it
10 matters. But I'll tell you they gave us a new note, and
11 it's a -- it's a good rate and good amortization. The
12 property's cash flowing, despite only being 78 percent
13 leased.
14 Q. Well, when does that note become due?
15 A. Five years.
16 Q. Five years.
18 Q. Who's your banker at Trustmark? Any particular
19 one that y'all --
20 A. George --
21 Q. -- use?
22 A. -- Gunn.
23 Q. Thanks.
24 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY MR. LAWS:
25 Q. The rent for Ergon, you said goes to Ergon

1 Properties?
3 Q. How does it get to the partnership? How is
4 that handled, or do you know?
5 A. That's -- John, I --
6 Q. And they keep it all?
7 A. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They keep it all to pay
8 the note, and they furnish me a monthly statement as to,
9 you know --
10 Q. So it's not (unintelligible) any cash to the
11 partnership at this point?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Have there been any charge-offs or charge-backs
14 from Ergon into your -- against your interest since the
15 last cash call two years ago?
16 A. It -- you know, when there's a cash call that
17 comes -- comes up, Ergon has always floated them. They
18 knew I didn't have it. Such as some of the space that's
19 not billed out -- it's never been leased. And with some
20 of the smaller mom and pop tenants, you know, we -- some
21 of them we've kicked out. Some of them we worked with.
22 Ergon's handled that financially. They -- Ergon,
23 fortunately, has not tried to take any of my 50 percent
24 interest. They've always floated it, and they've, you
25 know, been a good partner, so, no, there has not.

1 Q. So you still own 50 percent of the partner --

2 or Frazier Development still owns 50 percent of the
3 partnership? (Unintelligible) --
5 Q. -- (unintelligible). Yeah.
6 A. That's --
7 Q. But they're accruing the balance of that
8 deficiencies, and so you'll have to make it up at some
9 point?
10 A. That's correct, and that's been whittled
11 significantly down.
12 Q. Do you know what the balance is?
13 A. It's -- I -- I don't know exactly.
14 Q. About?
15 A. About probably 450, 450,000, but -- but that's
16 for Ergon, and I'd be responsible for half of that.
17 I'd say, you know, 225.
18 Q. Explain the transaction from the Flowood
19 developers and Shelby Brantley, whoever else was involved.
20 Was that where Frazier Development was basically paying
21 personal debt?
22 A. Brantley and Davidson had an investment with
23 me, and --
24 Q. With you personally?
25 A. No. In a -- in a company.

1 Q. Which company was --

2 A. In --
3 Q. -- that?
4 A. -- a company. In Jackson Metro, in -- what's
5 the other one? Brantley had one in a Gluckstadt
6 restaurant. There -- there were three. I can't remember
7 the third. And they approached me and wanted me to assign
8 two pieces of property to them, and that would more than
9 satisfy the debt. So what I did -- I transferred my 50
10 percent of Flowood Development to them, and written at the
11 bottom of the assignment, I told them I wanted a value.
12 And -- and -- and we took 100,000 less than we were each
13 carrying it on our financial statement, and that value was
14 $250,000. Their -- Brantley and Davidson's original
15 investment was 300,000. They said they wanted Six Shooter
16 land, for me to assign that, and it was intended to be as
17 collateral because I view, even in this economy, the land
18 being worth 5, $600,000, but --
19 Q. Your --
20 A. -- that's --
21 Q. -- portion of it?
22 A. -- my portion of the land. That was the only
23 thing that I owned that didn't have any debt on it, and it
24 made sense to me, and I signed an assignment on the land.
25 And I'm asking my Trustee to overturn that assignment, so

1 I can sell Six Shooter land and Six Shooter Lodge,

2 collectively. That's the way it needs to be sold.
3 Q. What I'm trying to get an understanding of --
4 Frazier Development owned 50 percent of Flowood
5 Development, and you used -- and so when you say you owned
6 it, that was the LLC, though, and the transfer of that to
7 some partners in another deal --
8 A. Frazier Development -- my father and I
9 transferred it to Davidson and Brantley via their LLC,
10 which is called Club Woodlands. That's the way the
11 transfer document -- it's a two-page, simple document that
12 is -- is -- you know, I have.
13 Q. But was their debt with Frazier Development --
14 does the other side of the transaction (unintelligible)
15 Frazier Development or with Claiborne --
16 A. With --
17 Q. -- Frazier?
18 A. -- Frazier Development.
19 Q. Okay. Now, you say you're trying to challenge
20 or unwind that transaction?
21 A. I am.
22 Q. All portions of it, or just the portion with
23 (unintelligible) Frazier or with --
24 A. Well --
25 Q. -- Six Shooter?

1 A. -- let -- let me clarify. I'm not trying to

2 unwind the Flowood transaction. I'm trying to force the
3 value that's written at the bottom of the document --
4 250,000 on it. What I am trying to unwind -- and I've
5 tried the past year and a half through various
6 attorneys -- is the Six Shooter land transfer.
8 Q. I'm going to ask a question here to clarify and
9 make sure I understand. You agreed that, either through
10 Brantley and Davidson or Club Woodland, however you say
11 that -- you owed them some money --
12 A. Correct.
13 Q. -- right? So you gave them the Flowood
14 Development for basically a credit, but y'all agreed on a
15 number, and it was $250,000?
16 A. Correct.
17 Q. And so once you gave them that, how much more
18 did you owe them at that point? How much were you
19 collateralizing?
20 A. In -- in my mind --
21 Q. Yeah--
22 A. -- I owed them about another $75,000.
23 Q. Jointly or each?
24 A. Jointly.
25 Q. Okay. All right. So you owed another 75,000

1 to them after you gave them Flowood Development, and so to

2 secure that 75,000, you were giving them an assignment in
3 Six Shooter until you could pay them the 75,000?
5 TRUSTEE: Okay. All right. Sorry. I just --
6 MR. LAWS: (Unintelligible).
7 TRUSTEE: I was trying to --
9 Q. Other than the Trustmark loan with Ergon
10 Frazier, have any of your other loans been paid or
11 refinanced? Are there any entities that you're involved
12 with -- any other loans that have been paid or refinanced
13 in the last six months?
14 A. No. I have no other loans.
15 Q. Do you have any life insurance with a cash
16 value that you're able to borrow against?
17 A. No.
18 Q. And have you received any income out of Ergon
19 Frazier in the last 12 months?
20 A. No.
21 Q. What's the status of C. E. Frazier
22 Construction?
23 A. The -- it was -- the bonding company took it
24 over in November of '07. My brother and father worked a
25 deal with Mike Harrell -- or my father worked a deal with

1 Mike Harrell for him to finish the work. And they went to
2 work at different times for -- for Mike Harrell, which is
3 owned by Roy Anderson. And my brother and father are
4 handling the wrap-up affairs of C. E. Frazier
5 Construction. I -- I don't know where that stands.
6 Q. Who owns C. E. Frazier Construction right now?
7 A. My father and my grandmother.
8 Q. Okay. So the bonding company didn't take
9 ownership? They just took over the property?
10 A. They just took control until we -- as I
11 understand it, until my father and brother cut a deal with
12 them that Harrell -- we basically merged, the way I view
13 it, with Harrell.
14 Q. You said you don't do anything with the
15 equipment at the construction company. Who does at this
16 point?
17 A. My -- what's left, my brother and -- my -- my
18 brother and father.
19 Q. Okay. There's some equipment behind y'all's
20 old office on Greenway Drive. Do you know if that's
21 Frazier Construction or --
22 A. My father sold that building to an Al Hunter,
23 and it had some owner financing, and this is going back a
24 year and a half, two years ago. I wouldn't think we would
25 have any equipment over there.

1 Q. There's a lawsuit against some kind of people

2 that owned Bonefish Grill. What's that lawsuit about?
3 A. There was -- Bonefish had a -- a side agreement
4 on some money, and long story short, it was settled for
5 $2,700 about three months ago. He -- our contention was
6 he took advantage of the situation I was in. Failed to
7 pay on an agreement, and we wanted Outback that owns
8 Bonefish to know about it, and, you know, we just -- got
9 sick of fighting it.
10 Q. Who paid that settlement?
11 A. A Gene Spinney (phonetic), who is the
12 franchisee of Bonefish.
13 Q. All right. That's all I have.
14 TRUSTEE: Lyle?
15 EXAMINATION BY MR. LYLE:
16 Q. Claiborne, I've just got a couple of questions.
17 A. Okay.
18 Q. The building that Atlantica Grill is in and
19 Bonefish -- is that part of Colony Crossing?
20 A. It's part of the development. Yes.
21 Q. And is that included in Ergon's -- do they own
22 50 percent of that, as well?
23 A. No.
24 Q. Okay. Those have been sold?
25 A. Yes. One was sold, and one was foreclosed on.

1 Q. Okay. That's really all (unintelligible).

2 MR. HINES: (Unintelligible) would like to
3 follow up.
4 TRUSTEE: Okay. Go ahead. For the record,
5 just say who you are.
6 MR. HINES: Yes, Breck Hines, again.
7 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY MR. HINES:
8 Q. Claiborne, you mentioned when I questioned you
9 earlier that you didn't have anything to do with equipment
10 in Belzoni. Have you been out there recently trying to
11 negotiate a sale to a local farmer in Belzoni of that
12 equipment?
13 A. I've got some people that are interested, and
14 I've -- there -- there's been two people that are
15 interested in the equipment. I've turned that over to
16 Austin. I've been up there because I keep stuff in my
17 room, but it was not just to negotiate a sale. No.
18 Q. Okay. So you're negotiating -- I mean, you
19 were talking to this guy about selling the equipment, but
20 yet you don't keep up with what's up there with this
21 gooseneck trailer that's all of a sudden gone missing?
22 A. I let him in the gate when I was going up there
23 to -- to get some clothes that I keep in my room, but, no,
24 I'm not negotiating (unintelligible) --
25 Q. So he may have stole it?

1 A. Breck, I don't know. You'd have to ask my

2 brother, Austin.
3 Q. There are -- outside of the Mathena metal
4 building, there were four trailer bodies filled with
5 furniture and other equipment. Who owns those?
6 A. Frazier Construction.
7 Q. Okay. That's all I have. Thank you.
8 (Unintelligible).
9 EXAMINATION BY MR. MALONE:
10 Q. Let me ask you something. My name is Drew
11 Malone. I represent Egan Construction. Back on the
12 Natchez hospital project, did you have an ownership
13 interest in Frazier Construction?
14 A. No.
15 Q. What about Frazier Development, or did you have
16 any interest at all in that project?
17 A. No. I have interest in Frazier Development,
18 and, you know, I don't recognize him as a creditor. I --
19 you know, I -- I -- I -- Egan is not -- I didn't list him
20 as a creditor. I'm glad to answer what questions I can.
21 Q. Are you aware of the lawsuit that's pending
22 down in Natchez against yourself and Austin and C. E. and
23 Frazier Development and Frazier Construction?
24 A. I'm not.
25 Q. That's all I have.

1 TRUSTEE: Anybody?
2 MR. BRUNT: Yeah, one more.
3 TRUSTEE: Go ahead.
4 MR. BRUNT: Billy Brunt with BankFirst.
5 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY MR. BRUNT:
6 Q. Claiborne, you mentioned that if you can get
7 the Six Shooter unwound, then you'll be able to sell it, I
8 guess, in an open market -- your interest in it?
9 A. Correct.
10 Q. Which means the condo and the land part, which
11 is what? 17, 16 percent, 16.6 percent?
12 A. The -- I own a seventh interest in the land
13 that was transferred, and I own a sixth interest, 16.6
14 percent in the lodge.
15 Q. If you're able to unwind all of that and you're
16 able to sell it, in your agreement with those other
17 partners, will you sell it to anybody you want to?
18 A. I can, but they do have a first right of
19 refusal on the land. We -- until I got into financial
20 trouble, there was no operating agreement on Six Shooter
21 Lodge. Now, they did run out there and put one together
22 that my brother and I -- Austin did not sign, so we're
23 operating under the state statute as far as we're
24 concerned.
25 Q. Okay. I guess the point is, if all of that

1 happens, and you get equity, how -- how much equity do you
2 think you would have? If you're successful in getting
3 that unwound and selling it, how much equity would you be
4 able to pull out of your interest in the land and the
5 lodge?
6 A. I contend in this market I could have 6 or
7 700,000 to go to creditors. Who knows, you know -- the
8 market goes up, you know, I'm -- I'm asking a million for
9 it, and we've got two people interested. But the other
10 members don't want me -- and I hadn't paid my dues -- they
11 don't want me on the property.
12 Q. Yeah.
13 A. And I'm trying to go about it the right way,
14 through the attorneys. My hope is it's up -- up close to
15 900 or a million, but, you know, it'll probably end up
16 being around 6, 700.
17 TRUSTEE: They've got a -- the other owners are
18 relying on the LLC agreement that they had or the state
19 statute, and they're basically claiming that you can't
20 sell this without their permission. I don't know if
21 they're right or not, but that's what they're saying now.
22 And they're keeping track of what is being called on for
23 cash, and what they're paying, and he's not paying his
24 share. And they've got an accountant and a valuation guy
25 by the name of Ralph Ross. Some of y'all probably know

1 Ralph, who was supposedly sending me a breakdown of all of

2 the moneys that have been spent and where they believe his
3 interest is, so I just hadn't looked at any of that yet.
4 But I did get an e-mail confirming that it was coming, so
5 I just don't know the answer to that yet. Yes, sir.
6 MR. KISSELBURGH: A couple of more questions.
7 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY MR. KISSELBURGH:
8 Q. Robert Kisselburgh representing Holly Hughes.
9 When you redid the loan with Trustmark, did they
10 actually -- did they ask you for a financial statement,
11 personally?
12 A. No, and -- and Ergon redid the loan.
13 Q. Okay. So Frazier Development was not involved
14 in it?
15 A. I have not signed any documents. I haven't
16 been asked to sign any documents.
17 Q. And you have not been asked -- either Frazier
18 Development or you, yourself, personally to provide an
19 updated financial statement?
20 A. I have been asked in the matter that you're
21 representing, and my accountant is working on that.
22 Q. Okay. Have you filed your 2008 taxes yet?
23 A. I have not.
24 Q. 2007?
25 A. No.

1 Q. 2006?
2 A. No.
3 Q. 2005?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Okay. When do you anticipate the 2006 or '07
6 taxes will be filed?
7 A. It's contingent on my accountant working out a
8 deal with the Trustee on payment to wrap up some LLCs.
9 There is a letter that was delivered yesterday, I'm told,
10 by my attorney's runner, to Derek's office. And my
11 accountant wants Derek to acknowledge this letter
12 regarding, you know, payment to do this work.
13 Q. Okay. What's your accountant's name?
14 A. Robert Parker.
15 Q. Where does your wife work?
16 A. Fox-Everett.
17 Q. And what does she do?
18 A. She is an account manager for insurance.
19 Q. That's all. Thank you.
20 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Henderson, pardon my
21 ignorance. How do I request a transcript of today's
22 (unintelligible)?
23 TRUSTEE: U. S. Trustee's office right here.
24 What they'll do is give it to you on a disk like this, and
25 you can play it, and then you can transcribe it yourself

1 or give it -- so... But instead of all of y'all doing it,

2 you might want to do one and make copies, and just kind of
3 share the costs. Mr. Laws?
5 Q. I have one more question. When did y'all last
6 receive an offer on the purchase of (unintelligible)?
7 A. Gosh. About eight or nine months ago.
8 Q. And what was the amount of that offer?
9 A. It was 18 -- 18.3 million, and it had a
10 financing contingency in there, and we had gotten
11 Trustmark receptive to financing the balance. This
12 company was putting down 40 percent. And we felt good
13 about it, and then the company shut the doors. It was a
14 company out of Ohio. And then about four months ago Ergon
15 had sold some property, and they were doing a section 1031
16 exchange. I was trying to sell my interest to them, and I
17 gave them a -- a number that I contend was about 75% of
18 what I felt like the value was worth, and they ended up
19 buying something else. It's actively on the market, not
20 through a broker, but we are trying to sell it.
21 Q. What was your value to Ergon?
22 A. My value for my interest was $2,000,000.
23 Q. And that was after the loan -- right after the
24 loan was paid off (unintelligible) --
25 A. No. That was just Ergon had money, and they

1 were going to pay me $2,000,000 to -- to buy my interest.

2 Q. And on the loan renewal, you didn't sign a --
3 Frazier Development didn't sign a guarantee or --
4 A. I was -- I was just told Monday that Trustmark
5 had agreed to this loan.
7 A. I have not been able to get in touch with Ken
8 Hodges to, you know -- in the past --
9 Q. So it may not close -- the -- the --
10 A. Yeah. Well, in the past, they have -- you
11 know, Ergon has sent me a consent that I've signed, but
12 I've -- I've got a call in to Ken. I have not heard back
13 from him.
14 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY MR. BRUNT:
15 Q. I want to clarify one thing, Claiborne. Billy
16 Brunt, BankFirst. Have you ever tried to negotiate or
17 have been offered any kind of -- either a reduced buyout
18 from Ergon to sell any of your interests --
19 A. I've negotiated and I've reduced what I feel
20 like the value is in an effort to sell it, and I -- I --
21 Q. Have --
22 A. -- did --
23 Q. -- they ever made you an offer that you
24 declined, of any sort?
25 A. They have never made me a hard offer that I've

1 declined. No, they haven't.

2 CONTINUED EXAMINATION OF MR. KISSELBURGH:
3 Q. Robert Kisselburgh for Holly Hughes. Have they
4 made you any offer?
5 A. They have made a verbal offer --
6 Q. Of what?
7 A. -- that they might pay a million dollars back
8 about three or four months ago.
9 Q. Who made --
10 A. The --
11 Q. -- that --
12 A. -- the --
13 Q. -- offer?
14 A. -- the property management guy that -- that --
15 that -- Keith Clair is his name. That they might pay a
16 million dollars, and I let him know that, you know, no, I
17 wouldn't -- I wouldn't take that. That I wanted to --
18 through -- of course, since I'm in a Chapter 7, through my
19 Trustee, I was going to do everything I could to convince
20 him to let's ride this market back up and sell it for, you
21 know -- it -- it -- where it should have sold, that we
22 came close to selling, you know, two or three years ago.
23 Q. Okay.
24 TRUSTEE: Eileen, does BancorpSouth have any
25 collateral left that it hasn't foreclosed, or you going to

1 try to get the stay lifted on?

2 MS. SHAFFER: I don't know what they're going
3 to do about the stay.
4 TRUSTEE: But do you know of any collateral
5 they got left?
6 MS. SHAFFER: I think there may be tract
7 (unintelligible).
8 TRUSTEE: Okay. All right. What about
9 BankFirst -- has it got any?
10 MR. BRUNT: I'm sorry.
11 TRUSTEE: Do you have any collateral that has
12 not been foreclosed or anything like that?
13 MR. BRUNT: No, sir.
14 TRUSTEE: Okay. Is anybody in here a secured
15 creditor that has collateral on something?
16 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've got various charging
17 orders on items. I don't know whether that makes us a
18 secured creditor or not. I mean, Mathena Wetlands, for
19 instance, we placed the first charging order on it before
20 anybody else knew about it.
21 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Derek, you know, and I
22 tried in an effort to satisfy the Hines and Laws -- there
23 was, you know, assignments and transfers for developer
24 fees and stuff like that, and charging orders that I've
25 worked with them over the past couple of years on.

1 TRUSTEE: All right. If you've got that, would

2 you just send them to me -- what you got, so I'll know
3 what you believe --
4 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think all of this has
5 been filed already on the docket, and I think
6 (unintelligible) most of y'all's has too, hasn't it?
7 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah. I mean, everything
8 should be -- should be -- or filed, at least in Madison
9 County, I believe, or else filed with the bankruptcy
10 court.
11 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, are they?
12 TRUSTEE: Have you already done that, too?
13 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Unintelligible).
14 TRUSTEE: Okay. Well, you can file them that
15 way. I just -- trying to decide because if the issue
16 would be that if we do turn in -- like Mathena, if we
17 decided to sell that somehow, we got to know who's got
18 liens against it, so we can notify them, so we'll know
19 whether we're getting money out of it or whether we're
20 just giving it to the lienholders or what we need to do.
21 I just want to be certain.
23 Q. All right, Mr. Frazier. I know you've answered
24 a lot of questions already. But, generally, you've got --
25 which we don't know what the taxes are going to be yet, if

1 any, right?
2 A. Right.
3 Q. Okay. And we don't know what your support
4 payments, child support, domestic, whatever, is going to
5 be, either. You've got them listed here, but you don't
6 actually know; is that right?
7 A. Correct.
8 Q. Okay. You realize, generally, that both of
9 those items, though, are nondischargeable in a bankruptcy?
10 A. I understand that.
11 UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do we --
12 TRUSTEE: Sir?
13 CONTINUED EXAMINATION BY MR. KISSELBURGH:
14 Q. Are you going to amend the schedule with regard
15 to the order that was entered in Tennessee.
16 A. We are going to attempt to amend the judgement.
17 I didn't have the financial -- the financial information
18 to submit. And I'm interviewing two attorneys today to
19 work on amending that judgement, so expect that. But if
20 there's something that I need for current -- I'll -- I'll
21 get with my attorney, and -- and -- and get what's
22 currently in place on the bankruptcy.
23 Q. Have you paid anything towards the care of Ella
24 Hughes?
25 A. No.

1 Q. Since her birth?

2 A. No.
3 TRUSTEE: I'm going to have the court send a
4 notice out that's going to set a claims bar date. I would
5 suggest that you file within that bar date, regardless of
6 whether you've got discharged or not. And then you've got
7 it on record of what you say you're owed, and if it gets
8 resolved or changed, you can take it up later. But you
9 don't want to let that date run on you, and not, at least,
10 have your claim filed.
12 Q. And then where you're working now -- like you
13 said, you're affiliated with this Americo broker. That's
14 what you testified about (unintelligible). But before
15 that, you had not been employed since October; is that
16 correct?
17 A. That's right.
18 Q. And your income right now is family
19 contributions, other than what you're making as a
20 commission --
21 A. Correct.
22 Q. -- is that right?
23 A. Correct.
24 Q. And these lawsuits that you've got listed here,
25 all are lawsuits, I think, that are listed against you or

1 the companies. But you don't have any claims that are
2 listed here, other than the one you told me about, but
3 it's not actually listed because it hadn't been filed;
4 is --
5 A. Correct.
6 Q. -- right?
7 A. It has not been filed.
8 Q. Okay. I think you need to get with Mr. Curtis
9 and be certain that your schedules get amended to reflect
10 everything that was asked here today on the ownership
11 interests, boats, four-wheelers. Anything you've got, you
12 need to be certain that it's in here. Okay. And if
13 there's an issue about clothes or personal property or
14 trailers, you're going to get another chance to get that
15 right. Let's be certain that you get it right. Okay?
16 A. Okay.
17 Q. But you need to talk to him and be serious
18 about itemizing the stuff out item by item. Okay?
19 A. Okay.
20 TRUSTEE: Anybody else? All right. That's all
21 I've got today. Thank you.
22
23
24
25

1 CERTIFICATE OF COURT REPORTER.

2 I, Sherry L. Purvis, Court Reporter and Notary
3 Public, in and for the State of Mississippi, hereby
4 certify that the foregoing 65 pages contain a true and
5 correct transcript of the Section 341 Meeting of Harris
6 Claiborne Frazier, to the best of my ability.
7 I further certify that I am not in the employ
8 of or related to any counsel or party in this matter and
9 have no interest, monetary or otherwise, in the final
10 outcome of this matter.
11 Witness my signature and seal this the _____
12 day of March, 2009.
13
14 SHERRY L. PURVIS, CSR #1566
15 My Commission Expires:
May 5, 2010
16
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25

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IN THE UNITED STATES BANKRUPTCY COURT

SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF MISSISSIPPI

HARRIS CLAIBORNE FRAZIER CASE NO. 08-03051-EE

CHAPTER 7 SECTION 341 MEETING

Eileen Shaffer for BancorpSouth

TRUSTEE: Derek A. Henderson

TRANSCRIBED BY: Sherry L. Purvis, CSR #1566

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 TRUSTEE: All right. Next I've got Harris

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 the same that's listed here?

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Frazier -- you had in August of 2008 various things

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Q. Okay. It's just --

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Q. What's your address now?

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Q. Okay. Did you sign a contract with him, or is

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Q. -- we'll get it clear. Okay. All right. And

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 A. On the property management side is a Keith

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 paid? Is that Keith Clair or Ken Hodges?

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Flowood. And it says assigned 50 percent, 2006, Frazier

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 intent on the Flowood Development to satisfy debt, but it

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 A. It's twelve million, seven fifty.

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 why it's listed --

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Q. Just they've owned it since they bought it?

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 it was sold for taxes, and that's part of the lawsuit

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 been the go between that I've been -- keeping me -- you

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 Van Buren bank accounts?

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 juvenile court for Williamson County, Tennessee, in the

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 A. My kids are down there.

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 the time you originally filed the bankruptcy?

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 who has the direct contact with them.

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 sale, and my stepfather and mother are currently trying to

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229

1 numbers. But the one with the Go-Devil's my brother's,

Sherry Purvis, CSR - (601) 605-0229