AN INTERVIEW WITH JACQUES ELLUL BY DAV
Aldous Huxley ha~ said thl.lt Jacques El­ scientisls, economists, and
lul "made the case" he had tried 10 make
in Brave New World.
Os Guinl1ess believes Ellul's is the
"cri/iea/voice of the seventies."
CNR.ISnAN1TY Too.1Y presents this inter­
view by David Glll, recognizing thai Ellul
does not always square wilh cr's theowg­
j'll
ieal POSi1 ion. I I is important, however,
[or thoughtful men and women ro be inrro­
duced 10 s1Ach an inj7l£ential Christian.
We especially hope thar this sludy o[
FUu/ will stimulate fresh though1 on how,
in lhis decade, we can deallvirh godli­
ness, comrm,mily, wirness. and daily work.
CT reorganized and extensl'vely edired
the interview' transcripts for publication,
ACKI'ACKER AND SAILOR IN HIS
SPARE TIME. Jacques Ellul is
a brother in Christ who en­
joys struggling against mountain and
sea.
But his real foe has for years been tlle
technological $Ociety, A little like Sam­
son, he has tritd'to pul! down lJle pil­
lars of a society in the grip of what he
calls "Technique," a "raving rational­
ism" that centers almost religiously in
[echno[vgy, The intrusive gods of science,
effj ciency, bureaucracy, arl ificiaJitv, ra­
tionalism, and secularism provoke him
to combat.
While criticizing these in The Techno­
logica{ Society and other works, his
larger purpose has been to call us away
from such petty gods to a relationsllip
wlIh lhe God who sets us free in Christ.
Hi~ 40 volumes hav(' been either his­
wry and sociology, or theology and eth­
ics. In tbem he has been a prophetic
voiv nol only La lawyers (he has been a
professor of law at the University of
Bord<;3ux), but to socjoJogi:>ts, polilical
16
and not only to ~cumenjC'al
bu t to evangelicals, Catholi
Christian::..
His work rattles the win
comfortable churches. offices
Ellul is patien t when qu
his background, But when at
to Christ, Scripture, and Ou
he moves to lhe edge of his
interior fires begin to burn.
provoke reflection, to ge t us
and genuinely kno"" our ne
He is now retired as pro
history and sociology of in
the University of Bordeaux.
views with him in France, I
by Prof. Joyce Hanks of th
of Costa Rica. My wife, Luci
tht tapes, which appear he
form,
CONVERSION, N
OCCUPATION, CAR
PROFESSOR
When did you discover the
intense, personal way?
As a young man I read ma
the Bible, but no one eve
them to me. For tllree mo
was 15 I attended a cate
taught by a pastor, but ev
not answer my questions. I
ing thai you were ne\'er to
these things i\ thome, su T
In.v mol her q ues lions, thou
slrong believing Protestant
was a Voltairian skeptic w
agre<:: with the Bible 01' wan
it.)
But a1 some point the Bibl
for you?
During 1927. while I wa
CHRISTlAN
 -,\l~'{Iti'~~;~fj/i~~(
'\,'-' .~-- ,sSt .!~'~'-~':::;---'~~,"::'_,->--~~ '-;:.r{'0j·,·_,t,:_~\_ f:. 1
..-;

r9:(~';i
\ (1

>~~\m;:?t?,~ ~~j-~~~~,>

I
i
1
! '" i
;:)

!i '\ ·.'t.f';lf'·'~;V/ ;;;, ",

\'
1.'
oj;-' . ' : 1'~ "_'" -'" ••••

!, ('
"

.f l ' ~(

l{t<' ;'d I
/
r..··---­

;.:!:~
}-. ::-i..
>,
<

,/

, ;'f~ ,I,

............ :­( ~j{{~

,(- ~
~i -~,?~ -"~'
_/' '
~ .i;'
"

'eel,~, ~

-E'" - .
~.
.,.".,\l
~i
"­ ,
i~
J+"o~

)i i.·..... \-:~(\'~:!;i6:'< \r~i/' .-l~1J\~-

.',' t,.; ",,,,! /' \' "_" i- I." ". '\;~,~\\r\
'I, '.' 'r" '.->'-:':~ , -, :_"'\~\l

.-
':
(' ~;~it' .,) -":-' ':(: - <-""'< ,\ '3~ ; , "

j v~ ,_, '~-:";-'-"~~ f,- (.",;_'-.0" '/ ;'-:'--'0\ I:.~

'~ r~~<:r) '."> .'

i;~t~~~~?:
, ,~ ':;: i'~

:' \,; I '­

....··r.." ......~'.

'( S,> ~,,,\~;-,-,,,,.",:i:~:<.t~,.>, ,_.~ .. _,..._~--.p~'L "J

<' "'l,' { .•••.. \ •• ..:;... , ....: ~ ~,j

L---- ::::~'::!':':'" .-C.,,__ ~~I=i;i t:./ ...f" '

),<:;~~:~:. "':'1 1"

for exam~ that would qualify me for UOI­ invitt:d me tu me'ct"~\i'lt{a little group of In addi rion to the significanc
-versify a dmi ~s ion, I stu died Gaeth e's Christian studen IS. these twO triend~, I'd ~tn'ss the id
Fau5t. Because of this T reread some hope, 1 have been very critical inte
'things in tIle Bible, especially the be­ Am ong early influences, you ha ve often tually. and have tned to state the
'- ginning of John. 1 was very impressed, mentioned your friendship with Jean as realistically as possible. But -a
-and continued to luok in the Bible over Bose and Bernard Charbonneau. When same time, hope i;; centra) in my w
the next few Years. For some reason I did you meet? and thought.
read Rom"lns' 8, which has been deci­ I became friends with Charbonneau
sive for me_ Marx posed an answer to as a SdlOOlboy o( 14 or so, I met Jean By what authors were you inOue
the political and economic questions I Bose much later when he was national in the 19305 and early '40s? Vem
-had as a university student. but he sec.retary for a Christian student move­ Eller has said that "Ellul keeps B
didn't answer the questions of my life. ment. He provided the direction for my on his desk, but Kierkegaard in
So it was reallv the Bible that convert­ theological slUdies, while Charbonneau hearL"
- edme_
especi all y inll uence d me in sociology. In about 1933 I began reading K
There was also a human elemem that This came not just through their ideas, kegaard. Each time 1 have read him
{;Ounted quite a bit. A swdent friwd bu t through their Jives_ been wonderfuL Each time he
 Answers from a Man
Who AsksHardQuestions
what I am thinking. Afler discovering
Kierkegaard. r read Calvin and then
Barth. Calvin was impossible! I spent a
whole year in the early forties st udying
him alone. I was very unhappv with i1. I
cannot get into Calvin's way of reason­
ing. He is a teacher. but Kierkegaard, it
is true, gets imo my heart.
Did you have trouble during the Nazi
occupa tion of France?
After i earned my doctorate in law in
1936, I taught as a university professor,
but I was dismissed by the Vichy gov­
ernment in 1940 on the ground that my
father had never become a Fl'ench citi­
zen. (I was also in trouble for my stale­
ments about tIle Germans.) Three ",,'eeks
late:r, in August 1940, my father wa,;
arrested and sent to a detention camp.
IVly wife and I lived on a small farm
near Bordeaux for the next four years
during [he occup3tion.
What did you do during this period?
I studied theology, for one thing. The
theological hcu] ty of Slra~bourg was
on the other side of the line of demarca­
tion, but gave me a program to study,
and conected my work b~' correspon­
dence.I did not receive the degree, how­
ever, since I did not finish the thesis.
During the war I also passed the exami­
nation [0 become a memher of the Uni­
versity of Bordeaux faculty of law. 1
V\Tote my 1943 book on the history of
the discipline of the French Refonned
Ii Church, my denomination. for this exam.
In your work with the Resistance, did
you help the Jewish community?
That is how I began. I tried to help
people, especially Jews, who were be­
ing pursued by the Germans. I found
false papers for them. 1 also organlzed
local Resislaflce group~ to serv'e as links
with the maquis. the guerrilla soldiers
in the outlying areas.
Then the liberation in t944?
Yes. 1 was appoinlcd professor of Jaw
at the University of Bordeaux. Also, at
the momenl of liberation those who
had led the Resistance were appointed
to various council posts in the city gov­
ernment. For a time 1 was in charge of
public works and commerce. But de­
spite our high hopes, I found political
~. reform constantly thwarted by corrup­
tion and bureaucracy.
18
From 1944 to 1980 you were at the Uni­
verslly of Bordeaux on the law faculty.
And from 1947 on you also ta ught at the
Instilute of Political Studies?
Yes, three hours a week 1 taught his­
tory of law, and at the InstiTUte two
!lours 3. week r t8 ugh t on iVlarx or one of
his successors.
My work on "Technique" and the
technologIcal society was developed
mostly in lectures at tile Inslirute of
Polilics. For the faculLy of la"",' [ have
taught only doctoral students for the
pasl 20 years.
How have you managed to get so many
things writlen?
No committee work, for one lhing.
But, nevertheless. it has al ways been a
great problem to find enough time to
\.vrite and to prepare for my classes.
One of my most important aClivities
over the years has been to take 10 or 12
students on a camping trip in the moun­
t3ins where we would reflect on various
political (sometimes religious) ideas, At
home, or even when we go on vaca tion.
I have wriIten from 6 to 8 o'clock each
morning, At that hour I don't bother
anyone. I sleep very little; that is my
sickness!
Did the theological and ethical books
originate as sermons?
Not exactly, but often my books were
the result of Bible studies I prepared luI'
church. 0)' for group" of stuuents who
asked me l0 addres~ a parucular subject.
BIBLICAL RELIABILITY
Some say that nearly 50 million Ameri­
cans profess to being "born again."
Your work is particularly important to
this community because both you and
they are deeply rooted in SCliptu<c. In­
emlney is an important issue here.
How do you understand it?
Essentially, \-\'e must ask where the
error li~s. The first queslion is not
whether a passage is literally correct.
but why ,he passage was written. The
Bible makes no mistakes when il comes
to the revelo. lion of God hi mseJ f, or man
himselJ. But in other respects it may be
contradictory. The Christian must a"k
what is more essential: to know who
God is, lhe One who liberates and par­
dons me, or to know that a text is cor­
rect according to modem scientIfic or
hiStorical research. The problem is that
our scientific controls are
what was considered an erro
ago might be considered t
Science may change; God ne
me.
Many cults believe in iner
what way must evangelicals
this?
II is necessary w call our
o(hers to an ethic of responsi
means we: ha ve to be respons
way we read Ihis Bible. \l"le
with our intelligence and wil
muniry, before God.
LEARNING ETlUCS
CHRIST
You have stressed, that Chri
conform to this world with
bondage and sin. Why do y
further in spelling out his
haps by drawing more 011 th
on the Mount?
I don't want to give direc
could be buil[ into a rigid ethi
The Sermon on the Mount ha
especially in the ethics of ho
love. 1 have begun with the eth
dom precisely to bring Christ
position of being free in obedie
we obey freely, the rest will co
IT an evangelical's love is r
his inner life. he may have mad
tion in the person ofJesus betw
Savior and him as Lord. Jesus
imporWnt for ethics nOI to s
two.
In your own experience, wha
ue of ernIJhasizhlg a person
with Christ in terms of ethiC
In France I often encounter
ers who find the words of Jesus
morally speaking, But they ta
est whatever in the person of J
It is necessal}' to explain that t
are true precisely bccause Je;;u
o[God.
'What do these ethical word
mean today?
That is the great question fo
nrA read these words as a man
dle Ages, or even of a hundred
cannot love my neighbor tod
taking into account the econ
lem~ pf our present sociery. i
him without recognizing that 1
with. and mutually responsib

evil inme world. It i;, no longer a question
of IOv1ng a neighbor who is somehow inde­
pendent of the economic si tuation. We are
now all responsible.
inerrancy. In
cals go beyo~a
What is the relation of the Old to the
New Testament in developing a bibli­
cal ethic? Our view of war, for instance,
needs to be illuminaled by the example
of Joshua and David. Yet how do we
rela te Christ to this?
All Scripture is inspired by God, and it
all reveals Jesus Christ to liS. \I,,'e can never
fully know the Christ by reading the Gos­
pels alone, so it is important to read the
Old TeSlamenl. All the Bible teaches us
CS FROM who Jesus is.
On the question of war in The Old Testa­
ment, we must remember that God is not
only a God of love, but also the Master of
history, and the Judge. The God who was
incarnated in Jesus ChriST can be a terrible
God: "It is a fearful thing to faJ] into the
hands of the Jiving God." This text from
Hebrews shows us tha t God can indeed be
a fearsome Being. But he is also our Fa­
ther. Calvinists have sometimes stressed
him as Judge and neglected him as Father.
One must not torget either side of God.
TIle Word of God teaches u.s who Jesus
Cluist is dwing all of history.
While some aim at high standards, olh­
el;S justify a second-rate discipleship
because they know they will fall short.
What would you say to them?
The rea] difficulty is always to knov..'
how to make God's calling concrete. Many
Clu-istians have become polilically in­
volved on behalf of the poor. But we must
ask, "Who are the truly poor?" It is not
fully obvious. The difficulty is co find how
to apply oW' faiTh in God to each situation.
As we do this, we must not allow seLf­
criticism to immobilize us. I don't know
finally if God accepts my actions and
choices: the final judgment is his to make.
BUll trust in his judgment, so r can act in
freedom.
EsCHATOLOGY AND
UNIVERSALISM
1 for me.I_c Can a preoccupation with the eod times
1an of the Mi~ potentially develop into an interest in ethi­
-cd years ago., cal actions in the pre..<;ent?
today witholjt We must not consider eschatOlogy as
~onomi(; probi .~.
something merd:y in the future lhat has
'. 1 cannot lov~ no reiatlonship to the present. Escha­
lal I am unite0 tology must be lived now. rt provides an
nsible for, t1i~' actual ethic.
/
/
L(
J~i - ".­
i:'7 .
~.
I?\,
'1~';
< •
Ii!
t /~~'~:
1JlIJ,if'" "\
\: ';~:T~~;:~;~7" l
.4;
~lft~(
How would you answer those who ques­
tion your eschatology because of its
universalism?
I make a difference berween judg­
ment and condemnation. I believe eve­
ryone undergoes the judgment. but that
does not necessarily mean God con­
demns. In my vicw, judgment doc:s not
consist of the weighing of the good and
the bad ai a whole lifetime, and ending
in the rejection, in certain cases, of the
lotal person. The judgment makes a
separation. God keeps all that has been
good and rejects everything in us that
has been evil.
In distinguishing between judgment
and condemnation, are you not separ­
ating between the person and his work
in a way that contradicts the Old Testa­
ment, where a person is what a person
does?
The works of a person lasl a lifetime.
They form a whole history_ There is no
separation between the being of lhe per­
son and his works. The judgment hap­
pens at the inten()fof this history of the
person_ There is a gradual creation ot a
person during all his lifetime. One can­
not view the human being as a static
enti ly. Being and doi ng are ine:». triea­
bIy linked. 0 f course, man's goodness is
not oa lural g00doess. Any he possesses
comes only by God's gr3ce, not by one's
own righteousness,
You have written that God's future
kingdom no\\' invades our present in a
- "~"'i'*'-
.
.. -......,
"--"
"~;,..-
~:'. '.,:,.
,;:~;:t~~~~~i'7i~'
way that is partial but still rea
God, at some point on our his
time line, decisively intervene an
ate a new heaven and a new eart
I am conVinced thallhere isa r
in history, a break, an End. But t
phasis of my writing has been
often neglected fact of a series of
ruptions in history by God, nOl ju
rupture a,
the las[ moment.
THE CHURCH OR
!N""DIVIDUALISM?
In your writings you stress two f
the lonely individual, and the col
mass forces of society. In laying so
stress on the individuaL, have you
enough stress to the chUlXh, \\!ith i
ity to stand up to the institutiona
cipalities and powers?
You arc right in pointing out the
individualistic aspects of my th
and life. I know it is true. Ac.
France (and America) have ten
lay too much emphasis on indiv
ism. But there al-e really not in
uals today, but a cro'lA'd-a so
lonely crowd. So i( is necessary to
cover what it means to be an indi
alone with God.
lt is difficult to go to lhe comm
All my life I have been in the chur
have tried to do all I can for il. B
has not worked Oln very well. It h
been a community. Since 1 wri
just with my head but with my
ience, it is very difficult for me to
on this subject. I have not exper
 JACQUES ELLUL:
AnswersfromaMan
Who Asks Hard Questions
community at the level of the World
Council of Churches. And for 30 years I
panicipated in tht national synod of
the Reformed Church of France; for 20
years I was 8 member of its na tional
council. But I always re\limed very un­
happy after the meetings of these groups.
On the local level, of course, in our
little group of 15 or 20 people. we expe­
rience some communit),', bUI on a small
scale. In Bible slUdies, for example.
whar 1 have learned has often come
from othel- members, even when I have
been the leader. They have pushed me
and caused me to learn new concepts.
This community bnngs out in me the
desire 10 do research. They make my
faith grow. I try to avoid the situation
where the group listens only to one per­
son. Rather, we should use the gifts of
all the members. But it is difficuh to
b,ing people to believe that within the
chur-ch everyone has a gift.
Is "CALLING" THE SAME AS
"WORK"?
Are you still convinced that the biblical
view of work must begin ""ith the Fall
rather than with the doctrine of Creation?
Classieally, Christians have held that
work existed in the Creation. But it -""as
work in a different sense there. \Vork in
Genesis 1 and 2 was not utilitarian. All
I>
s u galnst "Te
David Gill: A good deal of confusion
has surrounded the words "technique"
and "technology'" in EngliS,h transla­
tions -of your works. Many believe you
are opposed to all forms of tech nol ag'y.
and that you think it is not only non­
Christi<ln but antihuman. Perhaps the
French word technique ought to be
lranslated into Engl ish a~ "technique"
'i II (small 1) when 'it refers (0 vanous indi­
vidual techniques or to the general way
of thinking that is not meant 10 be a kind
of religion.
But what would you think of using
"Technique" (capital TJ in'Engllsh when
referring to the global, almost rei igious
ensemble of means, the way of think­
ing? Harper & Row will follow this
scheme in your neAt two books. How­
ever, the translator of The Technologi­
cal Svstem claims you approved the
~ ~
[he trees gavc their frui t spontaneously,
and though Adam was commissioned
to watch over the Garden, no enemies
threatened him there. So it was a g06d
work. a job, but not one that was a ne­
cessity.
Since God's work was creati ve and very
good. can we say that, as much as possi­
ble, our work ought to be creative, serv­
ing life, leading to products that are
vel")' good?
Yes, butl donot think we can say thal
Creation was a job, work, lor God. The
Greeks and Babylonians considered
Creation to be an effort. But the Bible
says it is the Word rather than a work.
It is something more simple than work,
I agree that God's act was creative. and
that what responds in us is word and
work. There is a work command, but
Adam and Eve were in the presence of
God, not merely doing a work or pursu­
ing a vocatIOn. The ideas of work ".od
vocation are confusing, bUT I believe
tha I vocation (calling) is always and
only service to God.
In your books you make a radical dis­
tinction between "work" and "calling."
But consider your work with the Pre­
vention Club [a ministry to troubled
young people in the city]. Does not eVE-
01 gV"l " It
continued use of "technology," even
for this glob"l idea. ­
Jacques Ellul; No! ,Never! Absolutely
not! In the first translation of The'Tech­
nological Society' it was decided to do
just what you are suggesting: use "Tech­
nique" with a capital T when il Wi!, a
question of the totillity of techniques.
We were not going [0 use the word
"technology_" But in spite Ofthl5. Iwas
told "technique" was not an English
word that could be used this way.
But I have never given my approval
10 it.
Gill: It is an innovative concept, so
why should we not innovate by using a
word in a new way?
Ellul: Exactly! It is €\)en becoming a
problem In France now because the COrl­
cepts of Technique and technology are
being confused. 0 give the reason for the hope
rything have an aspect of wo
And, likewise, cannot work b
calling from God?
I think 01 a young educator wh
with delinquents of the Prevcnri
He said thaI when he l,vorked
hours during the day he often d
the pay. But \\'hen he continued
hours because he loved them a
needed him, he became free,
activities became a calling, M
ple engaged in difficuJt "",'ork h
kind of experience.
In your conception of the rel
ethics to "work" and "callin
has being a Christian made a di
to you as a professor at the Un
of Bordeaux?
1 would like to answer on tw
one dealing with professionals
other with students. My frie
Bosc and I started the Assoc
Prmestant Proressionals. We d
proressiona1 problems. concret
as they are in life. The theo
would describe simply what t
soys, without spelling out wh
present should do. Then the pro
als were challenged to figure o
to do, what son of solution to
their problems.
We had some very differen
ences! It was easier for doct
nurses than for business peo
groups that never went along v
were those composed of bank
insurance agents,
How do you apply your views o
and "calling" to your relati
students?
\Vhen I began to te<ich, I qui
covered that the meaning of m
lay not in t]le science of tran
information, but in my relatio
my students. As in the case of m
studies, my university swdents
me to undertake' research on
questions. I did not do researc
sake of research, but because a
students were interested in a pa
question.
IT waS important for me that
dents knew I was a Christian
often lived the experience P
scribed: "Always be ready to
answer to everyone who ask
have." ThlO students shoDJd alw
 ~
. f.,~-, .­
:~~~<oh'ee to ask questions. When, for exam­
:.,i ,;pj~> 1 taught classes on the thought of
:;;,il:''';'€J\1arx and his successors, I did nOI try to
)rked ),: :~' ;teach that Marx was wrong. Marx said
Club.: ," fi?",;~ :~me admirable [hings, and I told my
eiglff '-~­ "/ _" :students .hat this was so. It was amus­
it foi
• -(~ ';ing to me, then, that students would then fell on the sidewalk. becoming
aft-er'
'often ask, "How can you teach this cdppleu and b lind as a resu It of a spinal
they
.when you are a Christian ?" So I would injury. The prosecuting attorney wa!> a
:l his
'be given opportunity to respond. Chlistian, as were: rhe defending attor­
peo-'
1 also felt it was important to be ney and the judge. I know all three
: this­ ,available w my students. I had a close
.pastoral relationship with many of them.
lU of :' Should we encourage people to bring
how their work into closer conformity to their
'cnce calling from God? Sometimes your writ­
l"Sity -ings seem to dismiss the possibility of
,service to God in one's secular work.
'vels, I would not have worked so much my­
j the self if 1 had not been convinced that
Jean work responds to a certain will o[ God,
l!l of ' and not only to a necessity of the world,
lssed , The difficulty comes in that it is neces­
just '" sary to appreciate a job in the measure
;ians' to which it is c!"eative and liberating. r
~jblt~­ :, agree with the Reformed tradition in
hose­ ';refusing to make a simple distinction
',between work that is good and work
,that is not good. I have a new group
-::forrning in Paris, composed of bankers
: and st'ockbrokers. They are Christians,
peri­ Can I tel] them that a Christian should
and ._not be a stockbroker? That is very diffi­
The 'cplt.to do.
weU
and 'Peter directed Cornelius's attention to
Christ as Lord, and left him as a Roman
'ce'nturion. But il was not long before
jnost Christian "Corneliuses" (army of­
,fleers) left their commissions, 'What
would happen jf we followed Paul's ex­
...,' ample with bankers and stockbrokers?
I agree with this approach, But the
. problem remains that there are various
-'techniques used in different jobs. It is
, difficult to judge accunltely and fairly
. whether me work is to the glory of
ious :God-that IS, whether it is creative and
-the liberating.
Ipof
ular Is it fair to summarize your adVice to
. Christian lawyers by saying that you
stu­ 'think they should gather to analyze
laVE" their profession and practice realisti­
:'cally? Do )'OU think they should study
biblical notions of justice and law, and
--then discuss and pray to discover what
this means for their law practices?
That is [l fair summary, The first
point is very important, especially for
lawyers, since they are tempted by ide­
alism. It is well and good to serve the
law, but they must understand the real­
ity of what is happening, Just laSI month
a young man struck his daughter, who
be either a means of getting (hem
accepl [heir condition, or a mean
cri t icizing sode,)', 1 believe this c
cism is specially imponant, and t
some new aSSOU3lions of workers m
quite well.
The father had a temper, but was a
good man, sensiti lie and devastated by
this accident, However, the press por­
trayed him as an unworthy. scandalous
father. The proseculOr was appalling,
and the defending lawyer had no con­
crete defense. The young man was sen­
tenced 1O 17 veal'S in prison and hunt:
himself the next day,
r told the lawyers afterward,"You did
not realistically judge the person in thi"
maHer." It is important to suess the
need of the legal profession to be realis­
tic and responsible,
What were your experiences with the
Association of Protestant Professionals?
Most lasted six years, from 1947 to
1953. Participants. who might have
been businessmen, [or instance, sub­
mitted problem5. We tried to get them
l:O reHect on practical matters. There
were cungresses, srudy courses, and coo­
sultatium. A businessman might sub­
mit a busmess ventUl-e for the group's
study and discussion, Two group~, doc­
tors and tea~~hers, have continued to
this day, bUl the others have not.
In some of your writings about alterna­
tive educatioll you have recommended
getting off into the mountains, camp­
ing and so on. Do you think a Christian
college is "'Tong to locate near a major
secular university?
In France there is an interesting ex­
periment at Aix-en-Provence. A group
of Christians have installed a theologi­
cal school right next to the university's
college of let ters and SCIences, They arc
succeeding very well. The university is
lay and secular, and has no mor,,1 pre­
concepti ons or idealism, The facu] ty of
theology is thus the place where student's
can find responses to theIr question,,;.
Can we hope that theologically and eth­
ically traiDed professionals might go back
to their churches and teach a Chris
view of work and discipleship to
blue-collar worke('S who worship w
them?
It sounds excellent. For workers, Ch
tianity has appeared at other time
be created, since American labor uni
an: not at all in the busi.ness of tra
lorming society. It is important to h
Christian associations that ponder cha
es in society.
~ERWORD,"
BY DAVID GILL
What are we 10 think ofjacques Ellul
the inlrodUCliOil 10 his In Season, Ou
Season I have stated pari or my O
ans\ver:
"While the label 'prophet" is tos
about rather loosely these days, I
lieve that in the case of Jacques Ellu
is fully appropriate, The value of
prophet lies in his abiliIy to disturb
status quo, to put in question ,""ha
taken for granted. to shed new light
old issues, to bring in a new persp
tive, As in the commission to [he prop
Jeremiah, the prophet acts by 'uproot
tearing down, destroying, and overthr
ing,' and by 'building and planting.'
prophet is both angry and compassi
ale. He brings a Word from outstde,
brings a challenge.
"On the other hand, the prophet
limitations. The prophet is not a teac
in t he full sense of the term. The teac
gives a more complete, reasoned ex
sition of the truth. filling it out and
plying it. Ellul's work has many rou
edges and not a few blind spots, ov
statcment~, and cont.radictions. As 'lea
ing,' Ellul's wod: is lacking in vari
ways. But' as 'prophecy: it is an exp
sive challenge that is ignored only
great loss. Americans need to gi v
continued and expandeJ hearing to
Bordeaux prophet in our technologi
wilderness."
David W. Gill i,~ dean and
associalf prQ!'eSSOI' ofChris­
{ian ethic5 a/ New College,
Berke.iey, California. He is
the author or The Word of
Gud in the Ethics of Jiicques
Ellul (Scarecrow; AlLA Mon·
ograph), and other writings on Ellul.